Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission-allowed"
Henning Schulzrinne <hgs@cs.columbia.edu> Tue, 01 May 2007 23:41 UTC
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From: Henning Schulzrinne <hgs@cs.columbia.edu>
Subject: Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission-allowed"
Date: Tue, 01 May 2007 19:42:13 -0400
To: Richard Barnes <rbarnes@bbn.com>
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Cc: Ted Hardie <hardie@qualcomm.com>, geopriv@ietf.org, "Rosen, Brian" <Brian.Rosen@neustar.biz>
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Your example seems to assume that the flag adds privacy by being set. Unfortunately, that's not the case. In your example, the privacy-conscious (emergency) caller will say 'no'. Let's assume that we have the standard two-stage routing (local + emergency services network). The call reaches the ESN and the flag indicates "sorry, no LoST". In this case, the only alternative is to fail the call. It's not like the LoST lookup is some optional frill for this call. Thus, the call will fail and, if you're lucky, the UA will retry, presumably after displaying a warning message to the user to the effect that no call will go through until they click off on the privacy release. The outcomes are thus exactly the same with or without the flag: a successful call, but no additional privacy, or no call. The hypothetical disclosure of information you mention is in no way prevented by having this flag set to 'no', even if all entities in the call path observe the flag. The correct way to protect privacy is to privacy-protect the signaling channel or, if you're truly paranoid, do bogus LoST queries to obfuscate real ones. The same is true for the pizza call, so this does not depend on the specific example. Henning On May 1, 2007, at 6:12 PM, Richard Barnes wrote: > Perhaps location information, by itself, devoid of all context, has > no privacy implications. But in practice, there's always context. > > If I see a LoST query go by containing a location, I can infer that > there's something at that location, and probably something capable > of calling for emergency services. If I want to jam emergency > calls in an area, LoST queries give me enough information to know > where to put my jammers. Or if I'm watching a stream of periodic > LoST queries, and I see one go outside the usual pattern, then I > know the location of someone making an emergency call. > > I have to agree with Ted: No means no, and when there are > exceptions, they should be made explicit. > > --Richard > _______________________________________________ Geopriv mailing list Geopriv@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/geopriv
- [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission-all… Rosen, Brian
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Dawson, Martin
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Moore, Lyn E
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Dawson, Martin
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Moore, Lyn E
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Tom-PT Taylor
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Brian Rosen
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Marc Linsner
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Francois Menard
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Marc Linsner
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Marc Linsner
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Brian Rosen
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Marc Linsner
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Brian Rosen
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Marc Linsner
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Tom-PT Taylor
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Brian Rosen
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Tom-PT Taylor
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Marc Linsner
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Brian Rosen
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Marc Linsner
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Dawson, Martin
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Tom-PT Taylor
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- RE: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Winterbottom, James
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Ted Hardie
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [Geopriv] Location in SIP and "retransmission… Matt Lepinski