Re: IPR Questions Raised by Sam Hartman at the IETF 73 Plenary

["AJ Jaghori" <ciscoworkz at gmail.com>]

Modifying an author's original work without specified permission;
regardless of new findings, coFrom ietf-bounces at ietf.org  Sat Dec 13 18:43:36 2008
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Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 21:43:25 -0500
From: "AJ Jaghori" <ciscoworkz at gmail.com>
To: "Christian Huitema" <huitema at windows.microsoft.com>, 
	"Scott Brim" <swb at employees.org>, 
	"lrosen at rosenlaw.com" <lrosen at rosenlaw.com>, 
	"ietf at ietf.org" <ietf at ietf.org>
Subject: Re: IPR Questions Raised by Sam Hartman at the IETF 73 Plenary
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Modifying an author's original work without specified permission;
regardless of new findings, constitutenstitutes a copyright infringement.




On 12/13/08, Christian Huitema <huitema at windows.microsoft.com> wrote:
>> You can improve any technology you want, modulo IPR -- that's not the
>> point here.  The problem is taking existing copyrighted text and using
>> it as a base for describing your technology.
>
> That's indeed the problem we stumbled upon years ago. Suppose that a
> contributor has written a complete description of technology X, getting it
> published as a 100 pages RFC. A remarkable feat, and a great contribution to
> the community. A few years letter, the working group realizes that they like
> the technology, but would like to change a couple options. That normally
> translates into changing a paragraph or two, resulting in a new RFC, more
> than 90% identical to the previous one.
>
> Suppose now that for whatever reasons, the original author disagrees with
> the changes, or with the new management of the working group, or with the
> new editor. People are human, these things do happen. IANAL, but my
> understanding at the time was that the original copyright still applied to
> the original text, and that the working group would be left with only bad
> options. They could issue a delta RFC that only contained the modifications,
> but that is somewhat confusing for the readers. Or they could undertake a
> complete rewriting of the standard, but that takes a long time and is also
> prone to errors and confusion.
>
> This is very much why we got the statement on copyrights in RFC 1602, in
> 1996. You will notice that copyrights were only mentioned as something we
> might need to worry about later in the appendix of the previous rules, RFC
> 1310 published in 1992.
>
> -- Christian Huitema
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ietf mailing list
> Ietf at ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
>


-- 
AJ Jaghori
Chief Network Architect | Author | Professor
ciscoworkz at gmail.com
M: 703.362.5002
_______________________________________________
Ietf mailing list
Ietf at ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf


s a copyright infringement.




On 12/13/08, Christian Huitema <huitema at windows.microsoft.com> wrote:
>> You can improve any technology you want, modulo IPR -- that's not the
>> point here.  The problem is taking existing copyrighted text and using
>> it as a base for describing your technology.
>
> That's indeed the problem we stumbled upon years ago. Suppose that a
> contributor has written a complete description of technology X, getting it
> published as a 100 pages RFC. A remarkable feat, and a great contribution to
> the community. A few years letter, the working group realizes that they like
> the technology, but would like to change a couple options. That normally
> translates into changing a paragraph or two, resulting in a new RFC, more
> than 90% identical to the previous one.
>
> Suppose now that for whatever reasons, the original author disagrees with
> the changes, or with the new management of the working group, or with the
> new editor. People are human, these things do happen. IANAL, but my
> understanding at the time was that the original copyright still applied to
> the original text, and that the working group would be left with only bad
> options. They could issue a delta RFC that only contained the modifications,
> but that is somewhat confusing for the readers. Or they could undertake a
> complete rewriting of the standard, but that takes a long time and is also
> prone to errors and confusion.
>
> This is very much why we got the statement on copyrights in RFC 1602, in
> 1996. You will notice that copyrights were only mentioned as something we
> might need to worry about later in the appendix of the previous rules, RFC
> 1310 published in 1992.
>
> -- Christian Huitema
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ietf mailing list
> Ietf at ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
>


-- 
AJ Jaghori
Chief Network Architect | Author | Professor
ciscoworkz at gmail.com
M: 703.362.5002
_______________________________________________
Ietf mailing list
Ietf at ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf