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dear john daywould you please reply just to the list , sorry it was not my intention to make such a fuzz when i involved brians opinion about u.i.a.
Thanks for the other opinions aswell. regards and happy new year Marc<https://sourceforge.net/project/screenshots.php?group_id=122388&ssid=96693 >
Am 29.12.2008 um 16:32 schrieb John Day:
Let me get this straight. You are saying that there are other reasons why an application should never see an IP address? And you feel that your reason is more important than simply getting level of abstractions wrong. So you agree?Yes, of course. There are lots of ugly things that can happen. You don't have to go very far to run into why. The question is why have we insisted on not doing it right for so long?Take care, John At 7:56 -0500 2008/12/29, John C Klensin wrote:--On Sunday, 28 December, 2008 16:22 -0500 John Day <jeanjour at comcast.net> wrote:Why should an application ever see an IP address? Applications manipulating IP addresses is like a Java program manipulating absolute memory pointers. A recipe for problems, but then you already know that.John, Let me try to explain, in a slightly different way, what I believe some others have tried to say. Suppose we all agree with the above as a principle and even accept your analogy (agreement isn't nearly that general, but skip that for the moment). Now consider an IPv6 host or a multihomed IPv4 host (as distinct from multihomed IPv4 network). The host will typically have multiple interfaces, multiple IP addresses, and, at least as we do things today and without other changes in the architecture, only one name. One could change the latter, but having the typical application know about multiple interfaces is, in most cases, fully as bad as knowing about the addresses -- one DNS name per interface is more or less the same as one DNS name per address. Now the application has to pick which interface to use in, e.g., opening a connection to another system. Doing that optimally, or even effectively, requires that it know routing information. But requiring the application to obtain and process routing information is worse than whatever you think about its using IP addresses -- the latter may be just a convenient handle ("blob") to identify what we have historically called an interface, but having the application process and interpret routing information is completely novel as far as the applications layer is concerned (as well as being a layer violation, etc., etc.) and requires skills and knowledge that application writers rarely have and still more rarely should need to use. At least to me, that is the key architectural problem here, not whatever nasty analogies one can draw about IP addresses. john
-- Les Enfants Terribles - WWW.LET.DE Marc Manthey 50672 Köln - Germany Hildeboldplatz 1a Tel.:0049-221-3558032 Mobil:0049-1577-3329231 mail: marc at let.de jabber :marc at kgraff.net IRC: #opencu freenode.net twitter: http://twitter.com/macbroadcast web: http://www.let.deOpinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise).
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