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> >> It ought to be, but unfortunately we have confounded the transport > >> entity > >> namespace with the network entity namespace with the point of > attachment > >> namespace. > > > > Not really. Many applications are actively managing their network > connections, and for a good reason. A network connection is not an > interface to an abstract "unified network". On the contrary, a network > interface implements a contract with a specific network. > > It seems to me that you're agreeing with me. It's exactly because the > three > namespaces I mentioned are mashed together by TCP/IP that applications > have > to do what you describe, rather than just saying "open a connection to > Christian's laptop." If "Christian's laptop" is the "transport" name space, and if the network entity namespace use different network entity names tFrom ietf-bounces at ietf.org Mon Dec 29 16:56:44 2008 Return-Path: <ietf-bounces at ietf.org> X-Original-To: ietf-archive at megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ietf-archive at core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BD3028C0F0; Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:56:44 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ietf at core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietf at core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C82628C2B6 for <ietf at core3.amsl.com>; Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:56:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -110.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-110.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.088, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9aI5vNXMnJQM for <ietf at core3.amsl.com>; Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:56:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.microsoft.com (mail1.microsoft.com [131.107.115.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AD4728C0F0 for <ietf at ietf.org>; Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:56:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from tk5-exhub-c103.redmond.corp.microsoft.com (157.54.88.96) by TK5-EXGWY-E801.partners.extranet.microsoft.com (10.251.56.50) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.291.1; Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:56:26 -0800 Received: from tk5-exmlt-w601.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com (157.54.18.32) by tk5-exhub-c103.redmond.corp.microsoft.com (157.54.88.96) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 8.1.291.1; Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:56:25 -0800 Received: from NA-EXMSG-W601.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com ([fe80::8de9:51a2:cd62:f122]) by tk5-exmlt-w601.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com ([157.54.18.32]) with mapi; Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:57:33 -0800 From: Christian Huitema <huitema at windows.microsoft.com> To: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter at gmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:56:19 -0800 Subject: RE: The internet architecture Thread-Topic: The internet architecture Thread-Index: AclqGKmVR8cZMK7MThKbXIyMF/LtHgAADK7g Message-ID: <8EFB68EAE061884A8517F2A755E8B60A19D2E66F4A at NA-EXMSG-W601.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> References: <20081229162852.79C526BE581 at mercury.lcs.mit.edu> <49592B28.6060001 at gmail.com> <8EFB68EAE061884A8517F2A755E8B60A19D2E66F03 at NA-EXMSG-W601.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> <49596FEA.6040909 at gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <49596FEA.6040909 at gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "ietf at ietf.org" <ietf at ietf.org> X-BeenThere: ietf at ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request at ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Post: <mailto:ietf at ietf.org> List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request at ietf.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request at ietf.org?subject=subscribe> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: ietf-bounces at ietf.org Errors-To: ietf-bounces at ietf.org > >> It ought to be, but unfortunately we have confounded the transport > >> entity > >> namespace with the network entity namespace with the point of > attachment > >> namespace. > > > > Not really. Many applications are actively managing their network > connections, and for a good reason. A network connection is not an > interface to an abstract "unified network". On the contrary, a network > interface implements a contract with a specific network. > > It seems to me that you're agreeing with me. It's exactly because the > three > namespaces I mentioned are mashed together by TCP/IP that applications > have > to do what you describe, rather than just saying "open a connection to > Christian's laptop." If "Christian's laptop" is the "transport" name space, and if the network entity namespace use different network entity names to designo designate the various "network contracts", then, yes, we probably agree. Although I am not sure that we should place too much emphasis on the name of physical entities like "Christian's laptop". What if the application process migrates from my laptop to my desktop? -- Christian Huitema _______________________________________________ Ietf mailing list Ietf at ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf ate the various "network contracts", then, yes, we probably agree. Although I am not sure that we should place too much emphasis on the name of physical entities like "Christian's laptop". What if the application process migrates from my laptop to my desktop? -- Christian Huitema _______________________________________________ Ietf mailing list Ietf at ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
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