RE: Retroactive changes

[todd.glassey at att.net]

So Jorge - are you FINALLY agreeing with me that the formulation of the IETF's "participation and submission process documents" creates a legitimate contract between the submitter and the IETF? And as such it must be dealt with as a contract - i.e. all parties must agree to any changes to said process for it to be reliable... and enforceable?

So, then if that is true, that there is a real contract erected by submitting something to the IETF, then let me ask... how was this process of whether the IPR WG had any legal capabilities to change/amend those IETF policies worked out??? For instance, did you as the IETF's Attorney of Record and an "Officer of the Court as a Practicing Attorney in this country", issue advice authorizing it? What about the rest of us who have documents submitted? We, those who have already submitted documents, never agreed to change squat as far as I can tell...

As a formal IT Auditor - What I am claiming is that they (the IPR WG) cant and so all of this garbage is a waste of time since without the approval of those who would be impacted by this change, including EVERYONE who has in the past ever submitted a document to the IETF, that this and these changes are unenforceable.

Can you point out any legal flaw in this logic in a formal reply and opinion? 


Todd Glassey CISM CIFI


 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Contreras, Jorge" <Jorge.Contreras at wilmerhale.com>
> exactly right
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand [mailto:harald at alvestrand.no]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2005 3:39 PM
> To: Contreras, Jorge; Black_David at emc.com; ipr-wg at ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Retroactive changes
> 
> 
> Jorge,
> 
> just checking that I understand correctly:
> 
> - a change to what rights the author gives to the IETF can't be made 
> retroactively by the IETF alone.
> - a change to what the IETF gives to others (provided it has the rights
> to 
> give) can be made by the IETF alone, no matter what the age of the
> document
> - any change the author and the IETF agree to is OK
> 
> Right?
> 
> --On 1. november 2005 17:36 -0500 "Contreras, Jorge" 
> <Jorge.Contreras at wilmerhale.com> wrote:
> 
> > Retroactive changes are difficult to do, unless implemented
> > by a governmental body.  The reason is that people who made
> > contributions in the past were entitled to rely on the rules
> > in effect at the time of their contributions.  It is not likely
> > that you could enforce a retroactive rule change against someone
> > who relied on the old rule, unless you obtained his or her
> > consent to the change.
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> Ipr-wg mailing list
> Ipr-wg at ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipr-wg



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