Re: [link-relations] app data wrt HTML usage, was: NEW APP DATA

Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch> Tue, 10 August 2010 20:51 UTC

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Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2010 20:51:47 +0000
From: Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch>
To: Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>
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Cc: link-relations@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [link-relations] app data wrt HTML usage, was: NEW APP DATA
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On Tue, 10 Aug 2010, Julian Reschke wrote:
> >
> > Because it wouldn't make any sense on<link> as defined. This is why 
> > conformance is an inherent part of the keywords. In fact, I am 
> > surprised other uses of these keywords don't have the same problem. 
> > For example, if we added "bookmark" (replacing the current 
> > registration which doesn't match real world usage of the keyword) to 
> > the registry, then a user agent would be unable to properly process it 
> > in an Atom environment or when used with a Link: header.
> 
> So maybe the "new" definition is simply incorrect. Why did you change 
> it?

To match real world usage.

> > > - Unconvinced that<a>  and<link>  require different treatment.
> > 
> > The simplest example of this is rel=stylesheet.
> 
> That seems rather arbitrary, of course semantics for a/@rel=stylesheet *could*
> be defined (scoped CSS comes to mind).

Well that's as may be, but currently reality isn't so. I presume you would 
agree that the registry should match reality.

> > > - Unconvinced that the default of "no" for<link> is right. If 
> > > somebody defines a link relation, and it doesn't make sense 
> > > on<link>, then it appears that something is very wrong with the 
> > > proposed semantics of the link relation.
> > 
> > There are very few where this is the case, but I don't see why that 
> > would mean a relation where this is the case is wrong.
> 
> If there are few, then this implies the default should not be "no".

The "default" is merely a shorthand for not having to list every current 
relation and its new value; if you would rather I just list every relation 
I would be happy to do that.

> That being said, I don't see anything in the definition of <link> which 
> makes it different from what the HTTP Link header, for instance, 
> defines. Maybe you could elaborate?

Elaborate on what? I didn't mention Link: headers here? I would not want 
to presuppose how Link: headers should work; I've already sent feedback on 
the Link: header work which has been rejected (e.g. the HTTP Link: header 
doesn't define how rel=stylesheet should work with the CSSOM, but that is 
apparently out of scope of the Link: header), so clearly my understanding 
of that issue is not complete. As such, I would certainly not want to 
presume to apply conformance requirements on usage of that header.

> > The issues had in fact been decided in an appropriate venue; I was 
> > surprised to find any resistance in the registration.
> 
> There was no conscious decision. As a matter of fact, there's a related 
> bug (<http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=10172>), which 
> hasn't been processed yet.

That's a different venue. The registration template links to a WHATWG 
specification, where this issue was considered and decided appropriately.

> That's why we'd want the links to point at a published draft, not at 
> work-in-progress.

The WHATWG spec is a published draft standard.

-- 
Ian Hickson               U+1047E                )\._.,--....,'``.    fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/       U+263A                /,   _.. \   _\  ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer.   `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'

[link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Mark Nottingham
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
[link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Mark Nottingham
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Mark Nottingham
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Philippe Le Hegaret
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Julian Reschke
[link-relations] app data wrt HTML usage, was: NE… Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Philippe Le Hegaret
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Bjoern Hoehrmann
Re: [link-relations] app data wrt HTML usage, was… Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] app data wrt HTML usage, was… Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] app data wrt HTML usage, was… Ian Hickson
Re: [link-relations] app data wrt HTML usage, was… Julian Reschke
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Mark Nottingham
Re: [link-relations] NEW APP DATA Mark Nottingham