Re: [Uri-review] Want a suggestion

[John Xiaogang Zhang <xiaogang at gridmo.com>]

Daniel R. Tobias wrote:

On 22 Jul 2005 at 17:25, John Xiaogang Zhang wrote:

  

To describe the issue, lets start from email address. My
understanding, an email address is actually a user ID, and  the email
address "xiaogang at gridmo.com" identifies the user "xiaogang" which
defined at "gridmo.com".
    

It could be a "user", but does not necessarily represent a login 
userid on that system; it could be a mailbox, list, or mail 
forwarding record.  What it represents is entirely system-specific, 
internal to the receiving system.
  

Sure, it is exactly what I think. And I think a "list" (mailing list) here is an alias of "group".

The same can apply to mailling lists and groups (mailling lists can be
considered as a kind of groups). I may define a group named as "grp1"
at the server "gridmo.com", and refer it as "grp1 at gridmo.com" in the
internet.
    

"In the internet" is meaningless in this context, as you have not 
specified what specific protocol is being used to define and use such 
a "group".

  

Em, that is one thing I am wondering. Certainly the full URI "mailto:grp1 at gridmo.com"
specifies the protocol, but when refer to an mailling list we usually only use
"grp1 at gridmo.com". That means in practise the protocol sometime be assumed from the
context.

Now, for some reason, I want to define some system-independent groups,
and store these information in some internat file (don't ask me why).
Assume a group id "grp2" is defined in an internet file with a URL
"myprotolcol:\\gridmo.com\mydir\mygrps.myml", and I want to refer this
group over the internet.
    

In normal URIs, assuming that hierarchical paths starting with a 
hostname are being used, there would be forward slashes there instead 
of the backslashes you showed.
  

Oops, it was accident from copy/paste in windows.

My questions:
1. Is there any existing standard to refer such a group (or close
enough)? 2. If not, then what is the best way to refer it?
    

I wouldn't expect there to be unless "group" were actually defined 
more specifically than the vague description you gave.
  

OK, let me desribe it again with the mailling list example. The mailing list
"uri-review at ietf.org" is defined in the server of ietf.org, which includes both
"dan at tobias.name" and "xiaogang at gridmo.com".

Now assume for some reason, either because having no privilege to create a mailling
list in the current system,  or for simplifying the migranting of the mailling list from
system to systema, a user wants to define her own mailling list, "grp2", and stores it
into a file named "mygrps.myml" at her own directory "myprotocol://gridmo.com/mydir".

Now the user wants a of her program to send a message to both "uri-review at ietf.org"
and "grp2", how should her to refer the later?

It would be looked a bit odd if both "uri-review at ietf.org" and
"myprotocol://gridmo.com/mydir/mygrps.myml#grp2" are listed as recipients at the
same time.

And it seems to me the format "grp2 at gridmo.com\mydir\mygrps.myml" will be more
consistant with "uri-review at ietf.org".

Certainly, what I am going to do is not about mailling list, but the situation is similar:
reference for a system-indepented group definition, with a format consistant with
references for system-specified groups.

My currently intention is, refer it as

  "grp2 at gridmo.com\mydir\mygrps.myml"

so that the format will consist with (at least close enough to)
existing user/group (or email address / mailing list) format.
    

Clearly inadequate, due to its failure to specify a protocol; also, 
in the standard URI format (assuming the backslashes are corrected to 
forward slashes) the "grp2@" part would be treated as a userid for 
"gridmo.com" since it directly precedes this hostname, rather than as 
something defined in the full URI.

  

Another possible but ugly alternative is,

  "grp2 at myprotolcol:\\gridmo.com\mydir\mygrps.myml"
    

That's not a proper URI, since there's no provision for anything to 
the left of the protocol.

What you (perhaps) want (it's rather unclear what you really want) 
might be expressed as a parameter or a fragment ID on the URI:

myprotocol://gridmo.com/mydir/mygrps.myml?group=grp2
myprotocol://gridmo.com/mydir/mygrps.myml#grp2
  

Best regards

Xiaogang

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