From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Wed Jan 5 01:02:55 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA08810 for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 01:02:55 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 43E3B5DD8C; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 01:02:24 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id F212E5DDA4; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 01:02:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from monitor.internaut.com (mg-206253202-42.ricochet.net [206.253.202.42]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id F17475DD8C for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 01:02:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from vaiobean ([204.57.137.45]) by monitor.internaut.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA31190 for ; Tue, 4 Jan 2000 21:54:25 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: From: "Bernard Aboba" To: Subject: The Road Ahead in the New Year Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2000 22:03:44 -0800 Message-ID: <00ea01bf5742$a260e3a0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Happy new year to everyone! Hope you and your families had a joyous holiday and have returned refreshed and ready to go back to work. Now that the holidays are over, I thought I'd say a few words about the AAA WG schedule and roadmap. In the 39 days prior to the IETF 46 submission deadline we made enormous progress in pulling together AAA network access requirements, and during the AAA WG we made further progress on understanding the relationship between requirements and winnowing them down. At this point, we are now focused on completing the requirements phase and so the next 16 days will be very busy for us. As noted in a previous e-mail we are scheduling an interim meeting for January 20-21 in San Jose, CA. If you are interested in registering, please send mail to aaa@monitor.internaut.com for details. The purpose of the interim meeting is to come to closure on the AAA network access requirements. This implies that we are expecting the authors of the network access requirements documents (NASREQ, Mobile IP, TIA 45.6, and the accounting documents) to attend if possible as well as to revise their drafts to reflect the IETF meeting discussion as well as any comments that were received. The minutes of the AAA WG meeting are available at http://www.drizzle.com/~aboba/AAA/IETF46/ietf46.txt and the slides at: http://www.drizzle.com/~aboba/AAA/IETF46/ietf46.zip Our objective for the interim meeting on January 20-21 is to have a revised summary network access AAA requirements document to work from, so having a revised set of input documents is a requirement for that. In order to leave enough time for revision of the AAA requirement summary prior to the interim meeting the goal is for authors to get their revisions in by January 7, 2000. Ouch! Yes, that is this Friday! Since some of you have just gotten back from vacation that might be pushing it somewhat, so a few days grace is probably in order. But we really do need to have fresh documents to work from at the interim meeting, so please, set some time aside for the revisions and get them in. I'll be sending out some mail to the authors describing the procedure for production of the revised AAA network requirements document tommorrow. Once again, happy new year! I am looking forward to a very productive new year for the AAA WG. The best is yet to come! From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Wed Jan 5 08:26:33 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id IAA14702 for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 08:26:33 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id EB16D5DD8E; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 08:26:11 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 89AD75DD94; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 08:26:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from btm4r4.alcatel.be (btm4r4.alcatel.be [195.207.101.110]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6516E5DD8E for ; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 08:26:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from btmq9s.rc.bel.alcatel.be (btmq9s.rc.bel.alcatel.be [138.203.65.182]) by btm4r4.alcatel.be (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA18572; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 14:25:32 +0100 (MET) Received: from alcatel.be ([138.203.66.115]) by btmq9s.rc.bel.alcatel.be (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA21866; Wed, 5 Jan 2000 14:25:31 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <38734649.48763174@alcatel.be> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 14:25:29 +0100 From: Ronnie Ekstein X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.61 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: nasreq@tdmx.rutgers.edu, aaa-wg@merit.edu, "Yves T'joens" , Olivier Paridaens , BERNARD SALES Subject: New draft version : draft-ekstein-nasreq-protcomp-01.txt Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by nic.merit.edu id IAA14702 hi *, we have recently submitted draft-ekstein-nasreq-protcomp-01txt. The draft gives a protocol comparison between the RADIUS, DIAMETER and COPS protocols. Although it has been submitted to the nasreq group, we think it might be of interest for the aaa WG too. We would be happy to receive improvements/comments on this document. Abstract -------- The purpose of this draft  is  to  provide  an  extensive  comparison between  the  RADIUS,  DIAMETER  and  COPS  protocols  as  these  are positioned as generic Authentication,  Authorization  and  Accounting (AAA)  protocols.  The  protocols  will  further be verified on their compliance to the NAS requirements described  in  [TBA]  and  roaming requirements described in RFC 2477. The NAS requirements are today not addressed, but will be so when they stabilise. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ekstein-nasreq-protcomp-01.txt This is at large 'work in progress' and we solicit any input that might help us to improve the quality of the draft. Kind regards, Ronnie Ekstein Yves T'Joens Bernard Sales Olivier Paridaens   From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Thu Jan 6 16:04:04 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA17878 for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:04:04 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 9D4535DDD0; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:03:38 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 479735DDA6; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:03:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from firewall.metratech.com (firewall.metratech.com [199.171.52.2]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with SMTP id 3EE765DDD0 for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:03:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.metratech.com by firewall.metratech.com via smtpd (for segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) with SMTP; 6 Jan 2000 21:05:22 UT Received: by mail.metratech.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:05:22 -0500 Message-ID: <11EB6FE7BD6FD311893100A0C9B40EB303324B@mail.metratech.com> From: Alan Blount To: "'aaa-wg@merit.edu'" Subject: list archive? Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:05:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk It appears that the aaa mailing list archive has disappeared from merit. The link from the aaa wg page on ietf.org no longer works. I looked around merit, but was unable to tell to where it has been relocated. Is it still around somewhere? Thanks, Alan Blount From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Thu Jan 6 16:29:12 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA18305 for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:29:12 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 97A8F5DDDE; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:27:13 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 57E925DDD1; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:27:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhub.fokus.gmd.de (mailhub.fokus.gmd.de [193.174.154.14]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE5B65DDDE for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 16:26:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from fokus.gmd.de (track [193.175.133.61]) by mailhub.fokus.gmd.de (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA24938; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 22:26:35 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3875089C.7ED0AF37@fokus.gmd.de> Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 22:26:52 +0100 From: Georg Carle X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.71 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.5 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alan Blount Cc: "'aaa-wg@merit.edu'" Subject: Re: list archive? References: <11EB6FE7BD6FD311893100A0C9B40EB303324B@mail.metratech.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Dear Alan, as a backup and for quicker European access, we also run archive of the aaa list: http://www.fokus.gmd.de/glone/ietf/aaa/ You also can retrieve the complete archive as text file: http://www.fokus.gmd.de/glone/ietf/mail-archive/aaa/current ftp://ftp.fokus.gmd.de/pub/glone/ietf-mail-archive/aaa/current The archive has all the mails starting from 03 Sep. 98 (Minutes of the Chicago AAA BOF). Best regards, Georg P.S. We also run an archive of the IRTF AAAARCH Authentication Authorisation Accounting ARCHitecture research group http://www.fokus.gmd.de/glone/research/aaaarch/ and in plain ascii: http://www.fokus.gmd.de/glone/research/mail-archive/aaaarch-current ftp://ftp.fokus.gmd.de/pub/glone/mail-archive/aaaarch-current It is the archive of the majordomo maintained mailing list aaaarch@fokus.gmd.de (For subscription to the mailing list, send e-mail to majordomo@fokus.gmd.de, with content of message subscribe aaaarch) Alan Blount wrote: > > It appears that the aaa mailing list archive has disappeared from merit. > The link from the aaa wg page on ietf.org no longer works. I looked around > merit, but was unable to tell to where it has been relocated. Is it still > around somewhere? > > Thanks, > Alan Blount -- Georg Carle E-mail: carle@fokus.gmd.de GMD FOKUS Tel.: +49-30 3463 7149 Kaiserin-Augusta-Allee 31 Fax: +49-30 3463 8149 D-10589 Berlin, Germany http://www.fokus.gmd.de/usr/carle/ From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Thu Jan 6 17:24:18 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA19479 for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:24:18 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 0E7C15DDD1; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:23:58 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id AB9625DDD0; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:23:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from backin5.merit.edu (backin5.merit.edu [198.108.60.28]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id E34EF5DDD0 for ; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:23:55 -0500 (EST) Received: by backin5.merit.edu (Postfix) id 88AD7A9503; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:23:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from Merit.edu (dwspencepc.merit.edu [198.108.62.224]) by backin5.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id D03CFA9502; Thu, 6 Jan 2000 17:23:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <387515FA.339A365A@Merit.edu> Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 17:23:54 -0500 From: "David W. Spence" Organization: Merit Network, Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alan Blount Cc: "'aaa-wg@merit.edu'" Subject: Re: list archive? References: <11EB6FE7BD6FD311893100A0C9B40EB303324B@mail.metratech.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Oops! The URL to our mailing list archives changed as part of a project to reorganize our web site. I am trying to see if I can get the old URL reinstated as an alias for the archive to fix old links and bookmarks. In the meantime the new URL for the AAA-WG@Merit.edu mailing list archive is: http://www.merit.edu/mail.archives/aaa-wg Sorry for the inconvenience. Alan Blount wrote: > > It appears that the aaa mailing list archive has disappeared from merit. > The link from the aaa wg page on ietf.org no longer works. I looked around > merit, but was unable to tell to where it has been relocated. Is it still > around somewhere? > > Thanks, > Alan Blount -- David W. Spence email: DWSpence@Merit.edu Senior Systems Research Programmer phone: (734) 615-2630 Merit Network, Inc. fax: (734) 647-3745 4151 Plymouth Road, Suite C Ann Arbor MI 48105-2785 U.S.A. From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Fri Jan 7 15:51:10 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA08096 for ; Fri, 7 Jan 2000 15:51:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 756005DDA9; Fri, 7 Jan 2000 15:51:01 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id A0E975DDC7; Fri, 7 Jan 2000 15:51:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from backin5.merit.edu (backin5.merit.edu [198.108.60.28]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12C115DDB9 for ; Fri, 7 Jan 2000 15:50:49 -0500 (EST) Received: by backin5.merit.edu (Postfix) id 98F80A9503; Fri, 7 Jan 2000 15:50:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from Merit.edu (dwspencepc.merit.edu [198.108.62.224]) by backin5.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 254C3A9502; Fri, 7 Jan 2000 15:50:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <387651A8.5FA74806@Merit.edu> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 15:50:48 -0500 From: "David W. Spence" Organization: Merit Network, Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alan Blount , "'aaa-wg@merit.edu'" Subject: Re: list archive? References: <11EB6FE7BD6FD311893100A0C9B40EB303324B@mail.metratech.com> <387515FA.339A365A@Merit.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk I got our webmaster to reinstate the old URL for the AAA mailing list archive as an alias for the new URL so that the ietf.org link and everybody's bookmarks should work once again. I apologize for the inconvenience this has caused. "David W. Spence" wrote: > > Oops! > > The URL to our mailing list archives changed as part of a project to > reorganize our web site. I am trying to see if I can get the old URL > reinstated as an alias for the archive to fix old links and bookmarks. In > the meantime the new URL for the AAA-WG@Merit.edu mailing list archive is: > > http://www.merit.edu/mail.archives/aaa-wg > > Sorry for the inconvenience. > > Alan Blount wrote: > > > > It appears that the aaa mailing list archive has disappeared from merit. > > The link from the aaa wg page on ietf.org no longer works. I looked around > > merit, but was unable to tell to where it has been relocated. Is it still > > around somewhere? > > > > Thanks, > > Alan Blount > > -- > David W. Spence email: DWSpence@Merit.edu > Senior Systems Research Programmer phone: (734) 615-2630 > Merit Network, Inc. fax: (734) 647-3745 > 4151 Plymouth Road, Suite C > Ann Arbor MI 48105-2785 > U.S.A. -- David W. Spence email: DWSpence@Merit.edu Senior Systems Research Programmer phone: (734) 615-2630 Merit Network, Inc. fax: (734) 647-3745 4151 Plymouth Road, Suite C Ann Arbor MI 48105-2785 U.S.A. From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Mon Jan 10 14:02:38 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA01665 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:02:38 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 905075DDBD; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 13:56:22 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 3B2985DE01; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 13:56:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from nerf.yikes.com (nerf.yikes.com [209.228.7.149]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17CB95DE07 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 13:56:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from [63.193.24.36] (rick.perlman.com [63.193.24.36]) by nerf.yikes.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA05690; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 10:55:23 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from perl@lucent.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: rdp@mail.yikes.com (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <00ea01bf5742$a260e3a0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> References: <00ea01bf5742$a260e3a0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 10:55:23 -0800 To: , From: Richard Perlman Subject: Re: The Road Ahead in the New Year Cc: cdr@livingston.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk All: I am very concerned about the ability of this working group to produce a useful set of requirements for a AAA protocol, at the January 20th meeting or ever. The present approach of taking 4 documents and assuming they constitute a full, universal set of AAA requirements is, in my opinion, flawed. At the very basic level, building a new AAA protocol is not pioneering work. We already have a AAA protocol - RADIUS - which is in wide-spread general use today and works. Yet, as we look to a next generation protocol, where is the document showing the delta between what RADIUS delivers today and what we feel is needed in the mid-term future? Why aren't the original RADIUS requirements part of this new process -- are they no longer valid? If so, why? And finally. What hypothesis is there that would allow anyone to believe that the needs of Access server manufactures, and mobile network operators form the total universe of AAA needs. Where is the document called: "AAA requirements of service providers and remote access networks." Today, after the unilaterally imposed 7-January cut-off for document upgrades, where is any of the data we need to build a real set of requirements. Instead, we have had long, pointless, arguments about how people "should" do business, about theoretical possibilities and business models based in imagination and not in actual practice. I think this situation requires some immediate, serious, attention. Richard As Bernard Aboba wrote (1/4/00 10:03 PM -0800): >The purpose of the interim meeting is >to come to closure on the AAA network >access requirements. This implies that >we are expecting the authors of the >network access requirements documents >(NASREQ, Mobile IP, TIA 45.6, and the >accounting documents) to attend if >possible as well as to revise their >drafts to reflect the IETF meeting >discussion as well as any >comments that were received. From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Mon Jan 10 16:08:43 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA04505 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 16:08:43 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 9EED25DD9E; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 16:08:12 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 53A775DD8F; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 16:08:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from max.phys.uu.nl (max.phys.uu.nl [131.211.32.73]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1C725DD8F for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 16:08:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.254.2] (hst36100.phys.uu.nl [131.211.36.100]) by max.phys.uu.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3/hjm) with ESMTP id WAA12807; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 22:08:05 +0100 (MET) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: delaat@mail.phys.uu.nl Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <00ea01bf5742$a260e3a0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 22:07:56 +0000 To: Richard Perlman , From: "C. de Laat" Subject: Re: The Road Ahead in the New Year Cc: cdr@livingston.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by nic.merit.edu id QAA04505 Hi, At 10:55 -0800 10/1/00, Richard Perlman wrote: >All: > >I am very concerned about the ability of this working group to >produce a useful set of requirements for a AAA protocol, at the >January 20th meeting or ever. > >The present approach of taking 4 documents and assuming they >constitute a full, universal set of AAA requirements is, in my >opinion, flawed. I would agree with the statement above if it was correct but I think that the nobody (or not that many bodies anyway) assume that that is the universal set of requirements. You may have missed that there is a kind of temporary spit in which an IRTF RG (http://www.irtf.org/charters/aaaarch.html) does the long term stuff until it is fit for engineering, while the short term mobile Ip and nasreq needs are taken forward bij the aaa-wg. The aaaarch rg takes a different set of requirements not restricted to the above mentioned applications. Best regards, Cees. _________________________________________________________________________ dr.ir. C.Th.A.M. de Laat Position work: N 52°05'8.3", E 5°10'1.9", home: N 52°02'14.0" E 005°09'26.7" From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Mon Jan 10 17:05:25 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA05598 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:05:25 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 64BF75DDA4; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:04:59 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 1FDBD5DDB5; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:04:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from nerf.yikes.com (nerf.yikes.com [209.228.7.149]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EFE45DDA4 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:04:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from [63.193.24.36] (rick.perlman.com [63.193.24.36]) by nerf.yikes.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA07636; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:04:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from perl@lucent.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: rdp@mail.yikes.com (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <00ea01bf5742$a260e3a0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:04:44 -0800 To: "C. de Laat" , From: Richard Perlman Subject: Re: The Road Ahead in the New Year Cc: cdr@livingston.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Cees: Thanks for making a little more sense of the IRTF announcement. However, I still don't see how we can do short term specs without a survey of some kind on present practices/uses/applications for AAA to be sure we are at least "present compatible." As I read the present requirement set I do not think it even meets the needs of today's vendors present offerings. Earlier this year I added a column to a document showing a comparison of the three "requirement" sets just to see if the total was indeed a super-set of present requirements -- I identified a number of deficiencies which I posted to this group. Richard As C. de Laat wrote (1/10/00 10:07 PM +0000): >I would agree with the statement above if it was correct but I think >that the nobody (or not that many bodies anyway) assume that that is >the universal set of requirements. You may have missed that there is >a kind of temporary spit in which an IRTF RG >(http://www.irtf.org/charters/aaaarch.html) does the long term stuff >until it is fit for engineering, while the short term mobile Ip and >nasreq needs are taken forward bij the aaa-wg. The aaaarch rg takes >a different set of requirements not restricted to the above >mentioned applications. From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Mon Jan 10 17:34:33 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA06113 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:34:33 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id C42ED5DD99; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:34:15 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 730E15DDBD; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:34:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp-2.hut.fi (smtp-2.hut.fi [130.233.228.92]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD9305DD99 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:34:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from cc.hut.fi (positron.tky.hut.fi [130.233.17.47]) by smtp-2.hut.fi (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id AAA78966; Tue, 11 Jan 2000 00:34:01 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <387A5E7E.271CCFA@cc.hut.fi> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 00:34:38 +0200 From: "Tom Weckström" Organization: HUT/TKK X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.3 i686) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Richard Perlman Cc: aaa-wg@merit.edu Subject: Re: The Road Ahead in the New Year References: <00ea01bf5742$a260e3a0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Richard, I understood that in this phase the WGs collect requirements for evaluating a suitable AAA protocol. I would guess that also the existing AAA protocols, at least RADIUS and DIAMETER, will be analyzed against these requirements. Regards, Tom Richard Perlman wrote: > > Cees: > > Thanks for making a little more sense of the IRTF announcement. > However, I still don't see how we can do short term specs without a > survey of some kind on present practices/uses/applications for AAA to > be sure we are at least "present compatible." > ... ... > Richard > > As C. de Laat wrote (1/10/00 10:07 PM +0000): > >I would agree with the statement above if it was correct but I think > >that the nobody (or not that many bodies anyway) assume that that is > >the universal set of requirements. You may have missed that there is > >a kind of temporary spit in which an IRTF RG > >(http://www.irtf.org/charters/aaaarch.html) does the long term stuff > >until it is fit for engineering, while the short term mobile Ip and > >nasreq needs are taken forward bij the aaa-wg. The aaaarch rg takes > >a different set of requirements not restricted to the above > >mentioned applications. -- Tom Weckström tweckstr@cc.hut.fi Otakaari 20 B 39 Helsinki University of Technology 02150 Espoo Department of Computer Science From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Mon Jan 10 17:37:06 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA06150 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:37:06 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 3810A5DDBD; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:36:46 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id EF1A55DDC3; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:36:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from rip.psg.com (rip.psg.com [147.28.0.39]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80A515DDBD for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:36:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from randy by rip.psg.com with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 127nQW-000GHS-00; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:36:40 -0800 From: Randy Bush MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: "Tom Weckström" Cc: Richard Perlman , aaa-wg@merit.edu Subject: Re: The Road Ahead in the New Year References: <00ea01bf5742$a260e3a0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> <387A5E7E.271CCFA@cc.hut.fi> Message-Id: Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 14:36:40 -0800 Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk > I understood that in this phase the WGs collect requirements for > evaluating a suitable AAA protocol. I would guess that also the existing > AAA protocols, at least RADIUS and DIAMETER, will be analyzed against > these requirements. draft-ekstein-nasreq-protcomp-01.txt From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Mon Jan 10 18:08:06 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA06727 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:08:06 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 42AB25DD96; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:07:41 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id D1F035DDC3; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:07:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp-2.hut.fi (smtp-2.hut.fi [130.233.228.92]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 920845DD96 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:07:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from cc.hut.fi (positron.tky.hut.fi [130.233.17.47]) by smtp-2.hut.fi (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id BAA79227; Tue, 11 Jan 2000 01:07:32 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <387A6659.B9015479@cc.hut.fi> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 01:08:09 +0200 From: "Tom Weckström" Organization: HUT/TKK X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.08 [en] (X11; I; Linux 2.2.3 i686) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Randy Bush Cc: aaa-wg@merit.edu Subject: Re: The Road Ahead in the New Year References: <00ea01bf5742$a260e3a0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> <387A5E7E.271CCFA@cc.hut.fi> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Randy Bush wrote: > > > I understood that in this phase the WGs collect requirements for > > evaluating a suitable AAA protocol. I would guess that also the existing > > AAA protocols, at least RADIUS and DIAMETER, will be analyzed against > > these requirements. > > draft-ekstein-nasreq-protcomp-01.txt Yes, that draft compares three AAA protocols extensively, and even against requirements from the NASREQ and RFC 2477. I think the job is not done, however, since all the new requirements are not covered in that draft. Tom -- Tom Weckström tweckstr@cc.hut.fi From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Mon Jan 10 18:30:47 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA07015 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:30:47 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id B1ACA5DDC3; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:30:03 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id EC3935DDC5; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:30:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from estrela.cmh.ascend.com (estrela.cmh.ascend.com [137.175.2.6]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7651C5DDC3 for ; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:29:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from picu.cmh.ascend.com (picu.cmh.ascend.com [137.175.81.55]) by estrela.cmh.ascend.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA01147; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:29:50 -0500 (EST) From: Aydin Edguer Received: by picu.cmh.ascend.com (8.9.1/95031605) id SAA16412; Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:29:49 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200001102329.SAA16412@picu.cmh.ascend.com> Subject: Re: The Road Ahead in the New Year To: perl@lucent.com (Richard Perlman) Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:29:49 -0500 (EST) Cc: aaa-wg@merit.edu In-Reply-To: from "Richard Perlman" at Jan 10, 2000 02:04:44 PM X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk > As I read the present requirement set I do not think it even meets > the needs of today's vendors present offerings. Earlier this year I > added a column to a document showing a comparison of the three > "requirement" sets just to see if the total was indeed a super-set of > present requirements -- I identified a number of deficiencies which I > posted to this group. I went back to your message from 24-Oct-1999 to try to find out which deficiencies you had identified. > > Additional requirements from current use You do list some specifics, but it is not clear to me that they are missing from the current documents. > > | Gateway between AAA | M | > > | Protocols | | This appears to just be a generalization of the "RADIUS gateway capability" that exists in the requirements document. Is there something specific you wanted to add? Are you suggesting that a method of encapsulating other AAA protocols within the new protocol be provided? > > | Maintain Accurate State | O | > > | of NAS port usage | | I believe this was assumed in the "Resource Management" and the "Real- time accounting" items that exists in the requirements document. - The AAA protocol MUST provide a means of collecting - resource state information ... - Access port usage by users, including concurrent usage and - usage pools. http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-nasreq-criteria-03.txt - NAS operators often require a real time view onto the status of ses- - sions served by a NAS. Therefore, the AAA protocol MUST support real- - time delivery of accounting and auditing information. http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-nasreq-criteria-03.txt Without an accurate image of NAS port usage, limiting concurrent usage, one of the "Resource Management" issues listed in the referenced document is impossible. If you think it needs to be more explicit, then that might be possible. > > | Verify Port usage | O | > > | on NAS | | I believe this was also assumed in the "Resource Management" and the "Real-time accounting" item that exists in the requirements document. - The AAA protocol MUST provide a means of collecting - resource state information ... - Access port usage by users, including concurrent usage and - usage pools. http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-nasreq-criteria-03.txt - NAS operators need to maintain an accurate view onto the status of - sessions served by a NAS, even through failure of the NA or AAA - server. Therefore, the AAA protocol MUST support a means of request- - ing current session state and accounting from the NAS on demand. http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-nasreq-criteria-03.txt > > | Determine access perms | S | > > | prior to call answer | | This is certainly a requirement. I thought it was already part of the existing document. - The AAA protocol MUST be able to support multi-phase authentication - methods ... - The AAA protocol MUST be able to carry the following types of identity - credentials: ... - Telephony dialing information such as Dialed Number Identifica- - tion Service (DNIS) and Caller ID. http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-nasreq-criteria-03.txt - - Call Management Services - - Information from the telephone system or gateway controller - arrives indicating that a call has been received - - The AAA server is consulted using the information supplied by - the telephone system (typically Called or Calling number - information) - - The server indicates whether to respond to the call by - answering it, or by returning a busy to the caller. - - The server may also need to allocate a port to receive a - call, and route it accordingly. http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-nasreq-nasmodel-01.txt > > | Provide alert/msg | O | > > | facility for AAA events | | Can you explain any further what you mean here and how it is different from the Real Time Accounting requirements? - In this con- - text, real time is defined as accounting information delivery begin- - ning within one second of the triggering event. http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-nasreq-criteria-03.txt Are you talking about non-accounting events? > > | Support secure storage | S | > > | of user passwords | | I do not see this as an issue for the *protocol*. This might be a requirement of a AAA server. In addition, the requirement for CHAP (which means the AAA server must be able to have the clear text of the user password) prevents the password from being truly "secure" from the storage manager. From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Thu Jan 13 12:02:32 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA28661 for ; Thu, 13 Jan 2000 12:02:32 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 868BD5DDC0; Thu, 13 Jan 2000 11:59:56 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 3F1AA5DDD9; Thu, 13 Jan 2000 11:59:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtprch1.nortel.com (smtprch1.nortelnetworks.com [192.135.215.14]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98D4D5DDC0 for ; Thu, 13 Jan 2000 11:59:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from zrchb200.us.nortel.com (actually zrchb200) by smtprch1.nortel.com; Thu, 13 Jan 2000 10:59:19 -0600 Received: by zrchb200.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) id ; Thu, 13 Jan 2000 10:59:16 -0600 Message-ID: From: "Basavaraj Patil" To: aaa-wg Subject: FW: [MOBILE-IP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 10:59:12 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_000_01BF5DE7.84978CBA" Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_000_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01BF5DE7.84978CBA" ------_=_NextPart_001_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" -----Original Message----- From: Internet-Drafts@IETF.ORG [mailto:Internet-Drafts@IETF.ORG] Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2000 5:41 AM To: MOBILE-IP@STANDARDS.NORTELNETWORKS.COM Subject: [MOBILE-IP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Routing for Wireless/Mobile Hosts Working Group of the IETF. Title : Mobile IP Authentication, Authorization, and Accounting Requirements Author(s) : S. Glass, T. Hiller, S. Jacobs, C. Perkins Filename : draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt Pages : 24 Date : 10-Jan-00 The Mobile IP and AAA working groups are currently looking at defining the requirements for Authentication, Authorization, and Accounting. This document contains the requirements which would have to be supported by a AAA service to aid in providing Mobile IP services. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. ------_=_NextPart_001_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable FW: [MOBILE-IP] I-D = ACTION:draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt


-----Original Message-----
From: Internet-Drafts@IETF.ORG [mailto:Internet-Drafts@IETF.ORG= ]
Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2000 5:41 AM
To: MOBILE-IP@STANDARDS.NORTELNETWORKS.COM
Subject: [MOBILE-IP] I-D = ACTION:draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt


A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line = Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Routing for = Wireless/Mobile Hosts Working Group of the IETF.

        = Title           : = Mobile IP Authentication, Authorization, and
          &nb= sp;           &nb= sp;   Accounting Requirements
        = Author(s)       : S. Glass, T. Hiller, S. = Jacobs, C. Perkins
        = Filename        : = draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt
        = Pages           : = 24
        = Date            = : 10-Jan-00

The Mobile IP and AAA working groups are currently = looking at
defining the requirements for Authentication, = Authorization, and
Accounting.  This document contains the = requirements which would
have to be supported by a AAA service to aid in = providing Mobile IP
services.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mobilei= p-aaa-reqs-01.txt

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. = Login with the username
"anonymous" and a password of your e-mail = address. After logging in,
type "cd internet-drafts" and then
        "get = draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt".

A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found = in
http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html
or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt


Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by = e-mail.

Send a message to:
        = mailserv@ietf.org.
In the body type:
        = "FILE = /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt".

NOTE:   The mail server at ietf.org can = return the document in
        = MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility.  To use = this
        feature, = insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the = "FILE"
        = command.  To decode the response(s), you will need = "munpack" or
        a = MIME-compliant mail reader.  Different MIME-compliant mail = readers
        exhibit = different behavior, especially when dealing with
        = "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been = split
        up into = multiple messages), so check your local documentation on
        how to = manipulate these messages.


Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant = mail reader
implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII = version of the
Internet-Draft.

  ------_=_NextPart_001_01BF5DE7.84978CBA-- ------_=_NextPart_000_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: message/rfc822 To: Subject: Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 05:52:41 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_002_01BF5DE7.84978CBA" ------_=_NextPart_002_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_003_01BF5DE7.84978CBA" ------_=_NextPart_003_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: text/plain ------_=_NextPart_003_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: text/html

  ------_=_NextPart_003_01BF5DE7.84978CBA-- ------_=_NextPart_002_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="ATT48842" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="ATT48842" Content-type: message/external-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20000110123354.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01.txt ------_=_NextPart_002_01BF5DE7.84978CBA Content-Type: message/external-body; site="internet-drafts"; dir="draft-ietf-mobileip-aaa-reqs-01"; mode="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp" ------_=_NextPart_002_01BF5DE7.84978CBA-- ------_=_NextPart_000_01BF5DE7.84978CBA-- From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Fri Jan 14 06:44:42 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id GAA21024 for ; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:42 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 86E8D5DDF0; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:08 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 400C65DE06; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf.org (odin.ietf.org [132.151.1.176]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46CB75DDF0 for ; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from CNRI.Reston.VA.US (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA14555; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:02 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200001141144.GAA14555@ietf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" To: IETF-Announce: ; Cc: aaa-wg@merit.edu From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Reply-To: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-aaa-acct-00.txt Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:01 -0500 Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Authentication, Authorization and Accounting Working Group of the IETF. Title : Introduction to Accounting Management Author(s) : B. Aboba, J. Arkko, D. Harrington Filename : draft-ietf-aaa-acct-00.txt Pages : 45 Date : 13-Jan-00 The field of Accounting Management is concerned with the collection of resource consumption data for the purposes of capacity and trend analysis, cost allocation, auditing, and billing. This document describes each of these problems, and discusses the issues involved in design of modern accounting systems. Since accounting applications do not have uniform security and reliability requirements, it is not possible to devise a single accounting protocol and set of security services that will meet all needs. Thus the goal of accounting management is to provide a set of tools that can be used to meet the requirements of each application. This document describes the currently available tools as well as the state of the art in accounting protocol design. A companion document, draft-ietf-aaa-accounting-attributes-0x.txt, reviews the state of the art in accounting attributes and record formats. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-aaa-acct-00.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-aaa-acct-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-aaa-acct-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20000113083621.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-aaa-acct-00.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-aaa-acct-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20000113083621.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Fri Jan 14 06:44:53 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id GAA21030 for ; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:52 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 1066E5DE36; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:23 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id B12395DE06; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf.org (odin.ietf.org [132.151.1.176]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id D47695DE36 for ; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from CNRI.Reston.VA.US (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA14597; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:17 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200001141144.GAA14597@ietf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" To: IETF-Announce: ; Cc: aaa-wg@merit.edu From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Reply-To: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-aaa-accounting-attributes-00.txt Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 06:44:16 -0500 Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Authentication, Authorization and Accounting Working Group of the IETF. Title : Accounting Attributes and Record Formats Author(s) : N. Brownlee, A. Blount Filename : draft-ietf-aaa-accounting-attributes-00.txt Pages : 30 Date : 13-Jan-00 This draft summarises IETF and ITU-T documents related to Accounting. A classification scheme for the Accounting Attributes in the summarised documents is presented. Exchange formats for Accounting data records are discussed, as are advantages and disadvantages of integrated versus separate record formats and transport protocols. This draft discusses service definition independence, extensibility, and versioning. Compound service definition capabilities are described. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-aaa-accounting-attributes-00.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-aaa-accounting-attributes-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-aaa-accounting-attributes-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20000113133923.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-aaa-accounting-attributes-00.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-aaa-accounting-attributes-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20000113133923.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Fri Jan 14 11:52:35 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA27994 for ; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 11:52:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 53BF45DD91; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 11:51:35 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 752AF5DE42; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 11:51:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from max.phys.uu.nl (max.phys.uu.nl [131.211.32.73]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F7995DE3C for ; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 11:51:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.16.185.143] (hst36130.phys.uu.nl [131.211.36.130]) by max.phys.uu.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3/hjm) with ESMTP id RAA02179; Fri, 14 Jan 2000 17:51:01 +0100 (MET) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: delaat@mail.phys.uu.nl Message-Id: Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 17:51:21 +0000 To: Richard Perlman From: "C. de Laat" Subject: Re: The Road Ahead in the New Year Cc: aaa-wg@merit.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by nic.merit.edu id LAA27994 >Cees: > >Thanks for making a little more sense of the IRTF announcement. >However, I still don't see how we can do short term specs without a >survey of some kind on present practices/uses/applications for AAA >to be sure we are at least "present compatible." I agree that you need to understand the problem which you try to solve, OR, you must have a vision how the future world should look like and you must convince the community that your model and/or protocol can make that happen. The authorisation subgroup chaired by John Vollbrecht made a survey on applications needing some kind of authorization. This work is written down in the drafts: "AAA Authorization Framework", draft- ietf-aaa-authz-arch-00.txt, and "AAA Authorization Application Examples", draft-ietf-aaa-authz-samp-00.txt . The resulting requirements are in the document: "AAA Authorization Requirements", draft-ietf-aaa-authorization-reqs-01.txt. In the Application Examples draft you will find 6 or 7 examples ranging from the two or three short term solution needing apps and the other apps, which the AAA-WG and IESG choose to put aside for valid reasons (boiling the ocean, etc...). The set aside stuff is currently a littlebit more vision stuff which rightfully belongs to a RG until fit for engineering, hence all involved (IRTF-chair, WG-AD's and WG+RG co-chairs ) considered the current WG-RG construction a best practice. I did not do an extensive look through all drafts but possibly a cross reference study of the first parts of the above mentioned drafts with the other specific AAA-WG drafts can solve a lot. The material gathered in the draft-ietf-aaa-authz-samp-00.txt was gathered by visiting various companies asking them how they conduct bussiness, what roles are played by whom, grabbing that in a model and asking back if the model indeed describes their bussiness (iteration process). I certainly do not suggest, or even know, if that process is needed for the short term AAA-WG work, but a cross reference study and feedback from some providers might solve this discussion in a few days. Best regards, Cees. > >As I read the present requirement set I do not think it even meets >the needs of today's vendors present offerings. Earlier this year I >added a column to a document showing a comparison of the three >"requirement" sets just to see if the total was indeed a super-set >of present requirements -- I identified a number of deficiencies >which I posted to this group. > >Richard _________________________________________________________________________ dr.ir. C.Th.A.M. de Laat Position work: N 52°05'8.3", E 5°10'1.9", home: N 52°02'14.0" E 005°09'26.7" From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Tue Jan 18 15:37:39 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA08691 for ; Tue, 18 Jan 2000 15:37:38 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id D1EF05DDBC; Tue, 18 Jan 2000 15:36:32 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id 90A3B5DDC0; Tue, 18 Jan 2000 15:36:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from monitor.internaut.com (mg-206253202-42.ricochet.net [206.253.202.42]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BCCC5DDBC for ; Tue, 18 Jan 2000 15:36:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from vaiobean ([204.57.137.45]) by monitor.internaut.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA59208 for ; Tue, 18 Jan 2000 12:26:56 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: From: "Bernard Aboba" To: Subject: Revised Network Access Requirements doc for discussion at Interim Meeting Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 12:36:22 -0800 Message-ID: <028c01bf61f3$af7bda20$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Please find below a pointer to a revised network access requirements document which we will work from at the Interim Meeting scheduled for January 20-21, 2000 in San Jose. Changes include addition of a terminology section and addition of clarifications based on the IETF 46 AAA WG meeting minutes. http://www.drizzle.com/~aboba/AAA/REQTS/draft-ietf-aaa-na-reqts-02.txt From owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Fri Jan 28 00:33:12 2000 Received: from segue.merit.edu (segue.merit.edu [198.108.1.41]) by nic.merit.edu (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA16228 for ; Fri, 28 Jan 2000 00:33:12 -0500 (EST) Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) id 2C62A5DD8D; Fri, 28 Jan 2000 00:32:25 -0500 (EST) Delivered-To: aaa-wg-outgoing@merit.edu Received: by segue.merit.edu (Postfix, from userid 56) id CF2D35DDA2; Fri, 28 Jan 2000 00:32:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from monitor.internaut.com (mg-206253202-57.ricochet.net [206.253.202.57]) by segue.merit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77C2F5DD8D for ; Fri, 28 Jan 2000 00:32:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from vaiobean ([204.57.137.45]) by monitor.internaut.com (8.9.2/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA75726 for ; Thu, 27 Jan 2000 21:22:18 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: From: "Bernard Aboba" To: Subject: Minutes of the interim meeting... Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 21:31:50 -0800 Message-ID: <00ad01bf6950$fb3c33b0$2d8939cc@ntdev.microsoft.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-aaa-bof@merit.edu Precedence: bulk Those who took minutes of the Interim meeting, please send them to myself and Paul. Thanks!