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FYI.<= span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial"= ,"sans-serif";color:black">

-------- Forwa= rding messages --------
From: "Hao Wang" <wangh13@mails.tsinghua.edu.cn>
Date: 2015-01-05 21:32:26
To: softwires <softwires@ietf.org<= /a>>
Subject: [Softwires] Fw: New Version Notification for draft-sun-softwire-ya= ng-01.txt

Dear all,

We have updated the -01 version= of YANG Data Model for IPv4-in-IPv6 Softwire. Here is a brief list of chan= ges we=A1=AFve made:
1. We divided lw4over6 module into two parts (lwB4+lwAFTR), in order to= manage lwB4 and lwAFTR separately.
2. Add MAP-T module.
3. Add an example for lw4over6 binding-table configuration.
4. Leave NAT44-specific parameters other than the external IP address and p= ort set as out of scope.
5. Editorial changes.
=A1=A1
Many thanks to Rajiv and Lishan for their inputs.
 

Please can you review this vers= ion. Comments are always welcome.

 

 

Best Regards and Happy New Year= ,
Hao Wang

 

 

----- Original = Message -----

Date: 2014-12-25, 17:00:32

Subject: New Version Notification fo= r draft-sun-softwire-yang-01.txt

 

A new version of I-D, draft-sun-softwire-yang-01.txt
has been successfully submitted by Hao Wang and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name: draft-sun-softwire-yang
Revision: 01
Title: YANG Data Model for IPv4-in-IPv6 Softwire
Document date: 2014-12-25
Group: Individual Submission
Pages: 29
URL: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-sun-softwire-yang-01.txt
Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-sun-softwire-yang/
Htmlized: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-sun-softwire-yang-01
Diff: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-sun-softwire-yang-01

Abstract:
   This document defines a YANG data model for the configura= tion and
   management of IPv4-in-IPv6 Softwire Border Routers and Cu= stomer
   Premises Equipment. It covers Lightweight 4over6, MAP-E a= nd MAP-T
   Softwire mechanisms.
            &nb= sp;            =             &nb= sp;            =             &nb= sp;            =        


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat

=  

--_000_B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA846D3192nkgeml501mbschi_-- --_004_B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA846D3192nkgeml501mbschi_ Content-Type: text/plain; name="ATT00003.txt" Content-Description: ATT00003.txt Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="ATT00003.txt"; size=142; creation-date="Mon, 02 Feb 2015 04:17:18 GMT"; modification-date="Mon, 02 Feb 2015 04:17:18 GMT" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NClNvZnR3aXJl cyBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNClNvZnR3aXJlc0BpZXRmLm9yZw0KaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcv bWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9zb2Z0d2lyZXMNCg== --_004_B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA846D3192nkgeml501mbschi_-- From nobody Wed Feb 4 23:44:38 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11BB11A0123 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2015 23:44:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Kd1M00tkCvwI for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2015 23:44:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from relais-inet.francetelecom.com (relais-ias243.francetelecom.com [80.12.204.243]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CFB861A01C6 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2015 23:44:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from omfeda05.si.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.198]) by omfeda10.si.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id F0E5437401E; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 08:44:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from Exchangemail-eme2.itn.ftgroup (unknown [10.114.31.56]) by omfeda05.si.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id D2CCD180051; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 08:44:31 +0100 (CET) Received: from OPEXCLILM34.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([169.254.4.53]) by OPEXCLILH04.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([10.114.31.56]) with mapi id 14.03.0224.002; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 08:44:31 +0100 From: To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Ladislav Lhotka Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] templates for protocol parameters Thread-Index: AQHQOhhq9iFCh9DVwUqY1BX71p/tpJzYgWaggAAI7ICAAAIsAIAAAOaAgAktamA= Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 07:44:31 +0000 Message-ID: <17255_1423122271_54D31F5F_17255_13383_1_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C79E590@OPEXCLILM34.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> References: <24813_1422615840_54CB6520_24813_3029_1_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7983B3@OPEXCLILM34.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <93FCC189-8062-4233-B18B-F069646802F9@nic.cz> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.168.234.5] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-PMX-Version: 6.0.3.2322014, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.2107409, Antispam-Data: 2015.2.5.53922 Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] templates for protocol parameters X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 07:44:37 -0000 Agree , #1 is better. Specific parameters overriding inherited. -----Original Message----- From: Acee Lindem (acee) [mailto:acee@cisco.com]=20 Sent: Friday, January 30, 2015 13:35 To: Ladislav Lhotka Cc: LITKOWSKI Stephane SCE/IBNF; rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] templates for protocol parameters On 1/30/15, 7:31 AM, "Ladislav Lhotka" wrote: > >> On 30 Jan 2015, at 13:24, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >>=20 >> Hi Stephane, Lada, >>=20 >> Would it be possible to define a general rule where the a value=20 >>specified for a data node in the template would only be used if that=20 >>data node is not explicitly specified? > >Yes, such an overriding would be useful. We also have to think about=20 >what to do with (leaf-)lists: if the same list appears in both the=20 >template and real instance, we could > >1. use only the list from the real instance, or > >2. merge both lists. While #2 would be useful at times, I think keeping consistent semantics (#1) would be preferred. Thanks, Acee=20 > >Lada > >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Acee >>=20 >> On 1/30/15, 6:03 AM, "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" >> wrote: >>=20 >>> Hi Lada, >>>=20 >>> The idea sounds good to me. In term of details, we must think about=20 >>> creating "intelligent" templates. >>> What I mean is that applying some parameters to some items only. >>>=20 >>> For example, being able to apply a routing-protocol template to only=20 >>>bgp instances which name matches a regexp ... >>>=20 >>> Here is what I see : >>> - being able to apply the template at multiple level=20 >>>(routing-instance level, or routing-protocol level) >>> - if the template is applied at routing-instance level, the=20=20 >>>routing-protocol part of the template routing-instance will apply to=20 >>>all routing-protocols that will match the container of the template=20 >>>(if type is OSPF within the template, it will apply only to OSPF=20 >>>routing >>>protocols) >>> - the name leaves in the template could be used to store a regular=20= =20 >>>expression, or maybe we need to use another leaf. The regexp will=20 >>>permit to identify which container are eligible for inheritance. >>>=20 >>> The main concern I have is if we develop such template for routing,=20 >>>would it be interesting to extend it to all configurations ?=20 >>>(routing, interfaces ...) >>>=20 >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Rtg-yang-coord [mailto:rtg-yang-coord-bounces@ietf.org] On=20 >>> Behalf Of Ladislav Lhotka >>> Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2015 11:03 >>> To: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >>> Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] templates for protocol parameters >>>=20 >>> Hi, >>>=20 >>> the templates that would allow for sharing/inheriting some protocol=20 >>> parameters may be implemented in the current "ietf-routing" module=20 >>> as >>> follows: >>>=20 >>> 1. Define a new identity for the template routing instances: >>>=20 >>> identity template-routing-instance { >>> base routing-instance; >>> } >>>=20 >>> 2. Define a new leaf under "routing-protocol" for referring to a=20=20 >>> template protocol instance: >>>=20 >>> leaf template-ref { >>> type leafref { >>> path "/rt:routing/rt:routing-instance/rt:routing-protocols" >>> + "/rt:routing-protocol/rt:name"; >>> } >>>=20 >>> With this, a routing instance of the type "template-routing-instance" >>> can be configured, and inside it any number of protocol instances=20 >>> (with appropriate types) containing template parameters. >>>=20 >>> A "real" protocol instance would then use the "template-ref" leaf=20 >>>for pointing to a template protocol instance and share/inherit its=20 >>>parameters. >>>=20 >>> I think it would then be easy to map inherited parameters in the=20 >>> protocol-centric design to such a template, and vice versa. >>>=20 >>> Could this work? >>>=20 >>> Lada >>>=20 >>> -- >>> Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >>> PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >>> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>_____________________________________________________________________ >>>___ >>>__ >>> _______________________________________________ >>>=20 >>> Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations=20= =20 >>>confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc pas etre=20 >>>diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=20 >>>ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler a l'expediteur et le=20 >>>detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages electroniques=20 >>>etant susceptibles d'alteration, Orange decline toute responsabilite=20 >>>si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci. >>>=20 >>> This message and its attachments may contain confidential or=20 >>> privileged information that may be protected by law; they should not=20 >>> be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. >>> If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender=20 >>> and delete this message and its attachments. >>> As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that=20 >>> have been modified, changed or falsified. >>> Thank you. >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >>> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >>=20 > >-- >Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C > > > > ___________________________________________________________________________= ______________________________________________ Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden= tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu= ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el= ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou = falsifie. Merci. This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf= ormation that may be protected by law; they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele= te this message and its attachments. As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been = modified, changed or falsified. Thank you. From nobody Thu Feb 5 02:52:06 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D21FC1A1B0E for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 02:52:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 51pPWd1h_HVZ for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 02:52:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from pipi.pi.nu (pipi.pi.nu [83.168.239.141]) (using TLSv1.1 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 02A841A1B13 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 02:52:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.12] (unknown [49.149.205.111]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: loa@pi.nu) by pipi.pi.nu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A45421801127 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 11:51:58 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 18:51:51 +0800 From: Loa Andersson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.2; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 10:52:05 -0000 Folks, I have what might be a naive question. People have told me that in Yang we want to separate functionality from technology, i.e. we will look at OAM, management, routing, signaling and traffic engineering as aggregate functions and build our tree based on that. Now if we are to model thing that are closely related e.g. MPLS OAM, signaling, routing and traffic engineering, does that mean that we have to work at separate pieces of the yang tree and repeat this for every piece of the technology? First, is this correctly understood or do I have to go back and discuss this again with the people proposing it? If it is correct why is it superior to what we did for SNMP, one MIB-module for each protocol? Are the decisions taken or is the jury still out? /Loa -- Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 From nobody Thu Feb 5 04:27:09 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A36B1A87AF for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 04:27:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.895 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jL-4yWO8GVH8 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 04:27:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from lucidvision.com (unknown [50.255.148.178]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE7711A7023 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 04:27:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.134] (unknown [50.255.148.177]) by lucidvision.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31F912DD5371; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 07:27:06 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2070.6\)) From: "Thomas D. Nadeau" In-Reply-To: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 07:27:05 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> To: Loa Andersson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2070.6) Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 12:27:08 -0000 > On Feb 5, 2015:5:51 AM, at 5:51 AM, Loa Andersson wrote: >=20 > Folks, >=20 > I have what might be a naive question. >=20 > People have told me that in Yang we want to separate functionality = from > technology, i.e. we will look at OAM, management, routing, signaling > and traffic engineering as aggregate functions and build our tree = based > on that. >=20 > Now if we are to model thing that are closely related e.g. MPLS OAM, > signaling, routing and traffic engineering, does that mean that we = have > to work at separate pieces of the yang tree and repeat this for every > piece of the technology? I think you can do a model dedicated to MPLS OAM. The analogy = is=20 pretty much similar to how MIBs are created. You can import bits or objects from all over the place to create things, or you can recreate = them in place. There is a trade-off about modularity versus = time-to-completion here and I very much am not in favor of being zealous one way or the = other. We also need to very much take an iterative process around these = models: they are not set in stone, and we should iterate on them to modify, = adapt and update them as necessary. With that in mind, we've been encouraging = people to just starting writing them as best as possible and implementing either = prototype code or actually putting them into products so that we can see how they = actually operate in the wild. --Tom > First, is this correctly understood or do I have to go back and = discuss > this again with the people proposing it? >=20 > If it is correct why is it superior to what we did for SNMP, one = MIB-module for each protocol? >=20 > Are the decisions taken or is the jury still out? >=20 > /Loa > --=20 >=20 >=20 > Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com > Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu > Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Rtg-yang-coord mailing list > Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >=20 From nobody Thu Feb 5 08:05:40 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3845D1A8761 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 08:05:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FnCh6lT2lfOq for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 08:05:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from asmtp1.iomartmail.com (asmtp1.iomartmail.com [62.128.201.248]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 285591A8868 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 08:05:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from asmtp1.iomartmail.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by asmtp1.iomartmail.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t15G555J031144 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 16:05:05 GMT Received: from 950129200 (089144197202.atnat0006.highway.a1.net [89.144.197.202]) (authenticated bits=0) by asmtp1.iomartmail.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t15G4ubG030942 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 16:05:01 GMT From: "Adrian Farrel" To: References: In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 16:04:57 -0000 Message-ID: <00ae01d0415d$805b3790$8111a6b0$@olddog.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00AF_01D0415D.805DF6B0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQJzcvWb9XreKXEvLbgRzeJkMtlc6wH6Rykdm4wBvdA= Content-Language: en-gb X-TM-AS-MML: disable X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.1.0.1576-7.5.0.1018-21306.000 X-TM-AS-Result: No--14.316-10.0-31-10 X-imss-scan-details: No--14.316-10.0-31-10 X-TMASE-MatchedRID: R/DDslwm1J+5rzEqaXlmzfs9nOJYqD5I+NvV7Tnxnsq1eX0jEQ9c6jnC luuairZEh8NBJrA+emI7NmpnoEc2GLNUVnqixiMOtT4jIeGRd/U6En2bnefhoNqCxkzSpW/X/kb lP0cRn9oF3HJtKgmToF/8Yqk/GbirsTV+96O03SGRGzV8Bxg0caF9fmgCNFjeMbjv12PWhcdWsr lQ+H3npbGceC2clcYJkNoIwIg3Qq2zEjaL635+tRMMmcrjEONdR0SX1OwlZFoFZUFNc+OC7TwyQ xox87JoF7PIFpb3aCpBVgr5vOsPONLF6Y0L7R/QcFEiuPxHjsW0X0Yw27VuouQ45nVtPqmxrsFU 8Uw5BC6ytmB2/5InT/zxIC9LasqudG57tpB6osSzLD5kmcW6ZBOySJ0+MHXaE435Dt6W/lg9JrC IEsrp9x/2e9RyQzWhWnMoQfS9Wq8Sd6sOmnf5YwAYYobwIbwCSHjWEz/Dpkz5N0o2THGRZFJQYf pG4rTPPw1HPwekKZKvuZFnZJPRfbRJSyX1kG9l462sl6NKNzCH7D1bP/FcOhHyswgJ7SqQBpNqU zwLvvf/+eSpHPvf+nPdcTGDah5FgZI1n6aNUzbf8GJjBXCUiJAX3UzEQF1GpRezBf/GshJ4ouZE jkeLRlQoq/z/x5QQnsUiwVqDOARSEgm2SMwgWSI9MxSOQ6CSXgqwd9ijktB+nKfe95RZCUv+Gv9 gyZL/8sxBWk93ZMxucz/xUkOEzaNu8PHnuFgvDrDTQZ5YEVp9LQinZ4QefK9dKZJ2VxiayeMtMD 9QOgCcvwj3ddqeiSKODC+qnmrB29xvVLNF+sW1VfZrX9mxWKeEHpeKxj1E/tilNzXqO58SY+gTV aRDsqGWlTl4Vse24oAIvstuAQJrrAzJeThclzOLiO2eUX8QC3WngmR2UqQO7V1OcsoRUw== Archived-At: Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] FW: WG Last Call for draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 and draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 WAS:RE: Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts available X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: adrian@olddog.co.uk List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 16:05:32 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01D0415D.805DF6B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit FYI Comments to the Netconf WG list (not here). Adrian From: Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich) [mailto:mehmet.ersue@nsn.com] Sent: 05 February 2015 13:23 To: netconf@ietf.org Cc: ops-ads@tools.ietf.org; rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org; int-ads@tools.ietf.org; app-ads@tools.ietf.org; core@ietf.org; 6tisch@ietf.org; 6lo@ietf.org; i2rs@ietf.org Subject: WG Last Call for draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 and draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 WAS:RE: Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts available Dear NETCONF WG, we hereby issue a WG Last Call for 3 weeks for the drafts below: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 Please review and send your comments to the NETCONF WG mailing list by February 26, 2015 EOB PT. The related draft-ietf-netconf-yang-library will follow with LC as soon as the remaining two issues are solved (see http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-library). RESTCONF documents are planned to publish as standard track documents. As RESTCONF is a major protocol we expect a detailed and thorough review within NETCONF WG but also by the related WGs before publishing. Therefore the WGLC is planned for 3 weeks and APP, INT and RTG area ADs will be informed as well as Core, I2rs, 6lo, and 6tisch WGs are invited to review. Please state explicitly that you have read/reviewed and whether you support the publication. Please indicate also if you plan to implement or have already implementation experience with RESTCONF. Thank you, Mehmet and Mahesh From: Netconf [mailto:netconf-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of ext Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich) Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2015 4:05 PM To: netconf@ietf.org Subject: [Netconf] Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts available All, 1 YANG patch and 9 Restconf issues have been solved and provided in the drafts below. These issues have been set to the status Review (https://github.com/netconf-wg/restconf/issues). Please check and comment on the drafts below before we go to WGLC soon: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 Regards, Mehmet ------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01D0415D.805DF6B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

FYI

Comments to the Netconf WG list (not = here).

Adrian

 

From: Ersue, Mehmet = (NSN - DE/Munich) [mailto:mehmet.ersue@nsn.com]
Sent: 05 = February 2015 13:23
To: netconf@ietf.org
Cc: = ops-ads@tools.ietf.org; rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org; int-ads@tools.ietf.org; = app-ads@tools.ietf.org; core@ietf.org; 6tisch@ietf.org; 6lo@ietf.org; = i2rs@ietf.org
Subject: WG Last Call for = draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 and draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 = WAS:RE: Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts = available

 

Dear NETCONF = WG,

 

we hereby issue a = WG Last Call for 3 weeks for the drafts below:

 

https://too= ls.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 =

https://too= ls.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 =

 

Please review and = send your comments to the NETCONF WG mailing list by February 26, 2015 = EOB PT.

The related = draft-ietf-netconf-yang-library will follow with LC as soon as the = remaining two issues are solved

(see = http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-library).

 

RESTCONF documents = are planned to publish as standard track = documents.

As RESTCONF is a = major protocol we expect a detailed and thorough review within NETCONF = WG but also by the related WGs before = publishing.

Therefore the WGLC = is planned for 3 weeks and APP, INT and RTG area ADs will be informed as = well as Core, I2rs, 6lo, and 6tisch WGs are invited to = review.

 

Please state = explicitly that you have read/reviewed and whether you support the = publication.

Please indicate = also if you plan to implement or have already implementation experience = with RESTCONF.

 

Thank = you,

Mehmet and = Mahesh

 

From: Netconf = [mailto:netconf-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of ext Ersue, Mehmet = (NSN - DE/Munich)
Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2015 4:05 = PM
To: netconf@ietf.org
Subject: [Netconf] = Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts = available

 

All,

 

1 YANG patch and = 9 Restconf issues have been solved and provided in the drafts below. =

These issues have = been set to the status Review (https://github.com= /netconf-wg/restconf/issues).

 

Please check and = comment on the drafts below before we go to WGLC = soon:

 

Regards,
Mehmet =

 

 

<= /body> ------=_NextPart_000_00AF_01D0415D.805DF6B0-- From nobody Thu Feb 5 11:07:55 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69E1D1A8A63 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 11:07:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2PgrnUKm0nnz for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 11:07:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from asmtp4.iomartmail.com (asmtp4.iomartmail.com [62.128.201.175]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3CC0D1A8A92 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 11:07:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from asmtp4.iomartmail.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by asmtp4.iomartmail.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t15IBGF6001009 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 18:11:16 GMT Received: from 950129200 (089144197202.atnat0006.highway.a1.net [89.144.197.202]) (authenticated bits=0) by asmtp4.iomartmail.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t15IBDSY000981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 18:11:16 GMT From: "Adrian Farrel" To: References: <54AFC20F.8040800@cisco.com> <54B0667E.9040404@cisco.com> <54D39044.2060909@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <54D39044.2060909@cisco.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2015 18:11:13 -0000 Message-ID: <019901d0416f$229c7a80$67d56f80$@olddog.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_019A_01D0416F.229EC470" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQIvZuq0th8O3WUTisfiGloV4lsm2QLzkOfcAhwNO5Kb+5IZIA== Content-Language: en-gb X-TM-AS-MML: disable X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.1.0.1576-7.5.0.1018-21306.001 X-TM-AS-Result: No--14.850-10.0-31-10 X-imss-scan-details: No--14.850-10.0-31-10 X-TMASE-MatchedRID: mIMb8eDo9tXOf6FUr/HJkWesORBA65F0F4q8hdmZvAiFLhVbWK8lx2hd vY2T9l+XE+4nnAUlGMHqHEp2n5BcUHkcCcTmih6B5gCHftmwEMKLH4rzyQtUPU7jjsR9q0/xJMJ XDJjkqdQFJeSYHhELa05uPyW6LzkRqjGcs/0XBi5T46Ow+EhYOHfNqxGhSZEaeN6Jz+wf2gjg9L It2OdOa5SKO/2nz9g5ELy2UWpMZecFZ32u8aHsrJJEUO2qIzlLebXaFXrQhJHoi/VSXuLh9OA3b jcQ1GjIFFhGTZT/2j3npsaBoHku5xWWiSqIOH1AuIwLnB3Aqp1bAoaK+wS4jTprwiT8W5kjk0W5 Kut9LRYjGlm4UNmjai+MSqCYiZi00Ck0omylLdFWjqaf7FeZ1QuK1hIitSIHSSUXkvSVAdy343o uPRa0DK4Jhlx7vdJetDYnx728ysJvyn2zA8sLgVVeGWZmxN2M1zqopo0lhEmc8XYLjxLMIV721f 1Z1L9K3uw2+3tn6o37psjgv3jTHDJmL3yrEczIz4XVyhFFZHL9sV9Tla1qi1cbfIj2Ta9s5NS4Q OzMK7t7CjyP3UZ5MbpGAQ2wD/3Qyx6w4CJ+2uX2Ii0VSfdeQzuvYa1v2IFhTx0U/40+rr7a6BBk IrnTcudLZPVW5sDNedxyf/baQ0eb2ohNz0F+pNT+TcIhUUCBZJAk04EAz2Un+p552csI1Y/sYBB J7n+d9sFE6GfY4gY8LuP+bOkMWp8voPxO05mszzuzg6dga4Iytf6nW43O0D3dpxIEGwCa8FhGjT p5WPfXX6lVF/9rGWm9pOpGwdpk2gKTowYKIa2eAiCmPx4NwGmRqNBHmBvevqq8s2MNhPDPPeN6H N6d7E+N7oe5M1Kp+VVHCMfxKQHidXjOE1Cg8Juxm7kkR9L/dJ6+HskWGnYvjg6eFbtmp13p+YW8 Er6tMc1ksNazHBD9EPmhPRVkZfGL0sNdH4CPUG9FuKxZE9E= Archived-At: Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] FW: YANG Model Coordination Group - seeking candidates X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: adrian@olddog.co.uk List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2015 19:07:53 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_019A_01D0416F.229EC470 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit FYI As previously discussed, the YANG Model Coordination Group will assist the OPS ADs (specifically Benoit) in the management of YANG issues across the whole of the IETF and in out-reach to other places where YANG work related to IETF protocols and the Internet is being done. There is obvious overlap with the work of the Routing Area YANG Technical Coordinators, but their role continues unchanged and you can see the results of their work on the wiki at http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgYangCoord Thanks, Adrian From: ietf [mailto:ietf-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Benoit Claise Sent: 05 February 2015 15:46 To: IETF-Discussion list Subject: Re: YANG Model Coordination Group - seeking candidates Dear all, We finished the interviews regarding the YANG Model Coordination Group. We were lucky to discuss with many good candidates, and we are pleased to let you know the following persons have been selected: Deborah Brungard Dean Bogdanovic Dave Meyer Carl Moberg On purpose, the different skills within the team are complementary: technical, management, development, and coordination skills. On top of that, a lot of connections to many different SDOs, consortia, and opensource groups. Yes, the goal was to select three persons, but we could not resist having more great people in the team. This group can be reached at yang-coord@ietf.org. Regards, Alia, Adrian, Joel, and Benoit Dear all, You may have seen this "IESG YANG Model Work Redistribution" message [1]: A YANG Model Coordination group (a RFC2418 directorate) will be created by the IESG to assist the AD and complement the work of the YANG Doctors, Operations and Management Directorate, Routing Area Directorate, and IAB liaison managers. The YANG doctors' responsibility to validate models remains unchanged. The YANG Model Coordination group will consist of three members and report to the Operations and Management AD that is responsible for the YANG Model work. The OPS ADs, in collaboration with the Routing ADs (since there is much routing-related YANG modeling work) will select candidates for this YANG Model Coordination Group. The high level mission is: Help with the development and coordination of the numerous YANG models within the IETF, and the promotion of YANG modeling in the industry. Practically, we seek candidates: - Familiar with YANG, - Familiar with the IETF, - Connected with (or aware of) the YANG data modeling efforts in the industry, - Connected to YANG models implementation, - Ready to commit approximately 1/3 of a full time job, for a period of one year. The role of the YANG Model Coordination group will be re-assessed after one year and may be continued. If so, new nominations will be sought and existing members of the group will be able to stand again or step down. The job description consists of: - Compiling, publishing, and maintaining an inventory of YANG models both produced by the IETF and available at other locations. - Evaluating and documenting how the existing YANG models fit together. Example: can the IGP, QoS, and ACL YANG models work together? - Documenting and tracking open issues (especially the issues crossing drafts, WGs, and areas) including issues of interaction and overlap of YANG models. - Generating and leading the discussions on the resolution of the open issues, in collaboration with the authors, WGs, WG chairs, YANG doctors, rtg-yang-coord mailing list, and the appropriate ADs - Participating in YANG model related design teams, as needed, to assist in the coordination as well as technical work. - Assisting with the coordination of design teams working to produce YANG models that describe and enable the provisioning and management of services. - Documenting and tracking functionality missing from YANG models including entire missing models. - Documenting YANG issues arising from YANG models - Producing monthly reports for the IETF community and present a summary of progress at each IETF meeting in the OPS-AREA meeting. - Close work with the OPS AD on building a community of YANG modelers that will bring YANG work into the IETF as appropriate, and that will enable interactions between IETF YANG models and models produced outside the IETF . Note that the practical details of the daily job will be discussed with the candidates. If you are ready for the challenge, please let the Routing and OPS ADs know ( "ops-ads@tools.ietf.org" , "rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org" ). We will accept candidates for a two weeks period starting now. The selected candidates will be announced soon after. Regards, Alia, Adrian, Joel, and Benoit [1] http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf-announce/current/msg13576.html ------=_NextPart_000_019A_01D0416F.229EC470 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

FYI

 

As previously discussed, the = YANG Model Coordination Group will assist the OPS ADs (specifically = Benoit) in the management of YANG issues across the whole of the IETF = and in out-reach to other places where YANG work related to IETF = protocols and the Internet is being done.

 

There is obvious overlap with = the work of the Routing Area YANG Technical Coordinators, but their role = continues unchanged and you can see the results of their work on the = wiki at = http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgYangCoord

 

Thanks,

Adrian

 

From: = ietf [mailto:ietf-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Benoit = Claise
Sent: 05 February 2015 15:46
To: = IETF-Discussion list
Subject: Re: YANG Model Coordination = Group - seeking candidates

 

Dear all,

We = finished the interviews regarding the YANG Model Coordination Group. =
We were lucky to discuss with many good candidates, and we are = pleased to let you know the following persons have been = selected:
    Deborah Brungard
    = Dean Bogdanovic
    Dave Meyer
    = Carl Moberg
   
On purpose, the different skills = within the team are complementary: technical, management, development, = and coordination skills. On top of that, a lot of connections to many = different SDOs, consortia, and opensource groups.

Yes, the goal = was to select three persons, but we could not resist having more great = people in the team.
This group can be reached at yang-coord@ietf.org. =

Regards, Alia, Adrian, Joel, and Benoit =

Dear all,


You may have seen this "IESG YANG Model Work = Redistribution" message [1]:

A YANG Model Coordination group = (a RFC2418 directorate) will be created by the IESG to assist the AD and = complement the work of the YANG Doctors, Operations and Management = Directorate, Routing Area Directorate, and IAB liaison managers. The = YANG doctors' responsibility to validate models remains unchanged. The = YANG Model Coordination group will consist of three members and report = to the Operations and Management AD that is responsible for the YANG = Model work.

The OPS ADs, in collaboration with the Routing ADs = (since there is much routing-related YANG modeling work) will select = candidates for this YANG Model Coordination Group.

The high level = mission is:

Help with the = development and coordination of the numerous YANG models within the = IETF, and the promotion of YANG modeling in the = industry.

Practically, we seek = candidates:
- Familiar with YANG,
- Familiar with the IETF,
- = Connected with (or aware of) the YANG data modeling efforts in the = industry,
- Connected to YANG models implementation,
- Ready to = commit approximately 1/3 of a full time job, for a period of one year. = The role of the YANG Model Coordination group will be re-assessed after = one year and may be continued. If so, new nominations will be sought and = existing members of the group will be able to stand again or step down. =

The job description consists of:
- Compiling, publishing, and = maintaining an inventory of YANG models both produced by the IETF and = available at other locations.    
- Evaluating and = documenting how the existing YANG models fit together.
  = Example: can the IGP, QoS, and ACL YANG models work together?
- = Documenting and tracking open issues (especially the issues crossing = drafts, WGs, and areas) including issues of interaction and overlap of = YANG models.
- Generating and leading the discussions on the = resolution of the open issues, in collaboration with the authors, WGs, = WG chairs, YANG doctors, rtg-yang-coord mailing list, and the = appropriate ADs
- Participating in YANG model related design teams, = as needed, to assist in the coordination as well as technical work.
- = Assisting with the coordination of design teams working to produce YANG = models that describe and enable the provisioning and management of = services.
- Documenting and tracking functionality missing from YANG = models including entire missing models.
- Documenting YANG issues = arising from YANG models
- Producing monthly reports for the IETF = community and present a summary of progress at each IETF meeting in the = OPS-AREA meeting.
- Close work with the OPS AD on building a = community of YANG modelers that will bring YANG work into the IETF as = appropriate, and that will enable interactions between IETF YANG models = and models produced outside the IETF .
Note that the practical = details of the daily job will be discussed with the = candidates.

  
If = you are ready for the challenge, please let the Routing and OPS ADs know = ("ops-ads@tools.ietf.org"= <ops-ads@tools.ietf.org>= , "rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org"= <rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org>= ).

We will accept candidates for a two weeks period starting = now. The selected candidates will be announced soon = after.

Regards, Alia, Adrian, Joel, and Benoit

[1] http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf-announce/current/msg13= 576.html

 

 

 

 

------=_NextPart_000_019A_01D0416F.229EC470-- From nobody Thu Feb 5 21:07:47 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E8FF1A0393 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 21:07:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wHRm18O3cICv for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 21:07:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from pipi.pi.nu (pipi.pi.nu [83.168.239.141]) (using TLSv1.1 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 004F41A039C for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2015 21:07:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.12] (unknown [49.149.205.111]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: loa@pi.nu) by pipi.pi.nu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A78EB18013E4; Fri, 6 Feb 2015 06:07:36 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <54D44C11.2080902@pi.nu> Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2015 13:07:29 +0800 From: Loa Andersson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.2; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Thomas D. Nadeau" References: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2015 05:07:44 -0000 Tom, On 2015-02-05 20:27, Thomas D. Nadeau wrote: > >> On Feb 5, 2015:5:51 AM, at 5:51 AM, Loa Andersson wrote: >> >> Folks, >> >> I have what might be a naive question. >> >> People have told me that in Yang we want to separate functionality from >> technology, i.e. we will look at OAM, management, routing, signaling >> and traffic engineering as aggregate functions and build our tree based >> on that. >> >> Now if we are to model thing that are closely related e.g. MPLS OAM, >> signaling, routing and traffic engineering, does that mean that we have >> to work at separate pieces of the yang tree and repeat this for every >> piece of the technology? > > I think you can do a model dedicated to MPLS OAM. The analogy is > pretty much similar to how MIBs are created. You can import bits or > objects from all over the place to create things, or you can recreate them > in place. There is a trade-off about modularity versus time-to-completion > here and I very much am not in favor of being zealous one way or the other. > > We also need to very much take an iterative process around these models: > they are not set in stone, and we should iterate on them to modify, adapt > and update them as necessary. With that in mind, we've been encouraging people to > just starting writing them as best as possible and implementing either prototype > code or actually putting them into products so that we can see how they actually > operate in the wild. I thought there were activities going on to define an overall IETF yang model, right? If we say we approach this in an iterative way would the overall yang-model be the outcome of that process, rather than an input to it. Or do I miss something? /Loa > > --Tom > > >> First, is this correctly understood or do I have to go back and discuss >> this again with the people proposing it? >> >> If it is correct why is it superior to what we did for SNMP, one MIB-module for each protocol? >> >> Are the decisions taken or is the jury still out? >> >> /Loa >> -- >> >> >> Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com >> Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu >> Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >> > -- Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 From nobody Fri Feb 6 08:33:07 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BC271A6FF1 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2015 08:32:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.895 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kX95NaY2uAEi for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2015 08:32:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from lucidvision.com (unknown [50.255.148.178]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A08101A6FE9 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2015 08:32:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.134] (unknown [50.255.148.177]) by lucidvision.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 154972DEB931; Fri, 6 Feb 2015 11:32:49 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2070.6\)) From: "Thomas D. Nadeau" In-Reply-To: <54D44C11.2080902@pi.nu> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2015 11:32:48 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> <54D44C11.2080902@pi.nu> To: Loa Andersson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2070.6) Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2015 16:32:56 -0000 > On Feb 6, 2015:12:07 AM, at 12:07 AM, Loa Andersson wrote: >=20 > Tom, >=20 > On 2015-02-05 20:27, Thomas D. Nadeau wrote: >>=20 >>> On Feb 5, 2015:5:51 AM, at 5:51 AM, Loa Andersson wrote: >>>=20 >>> Folks, >>>=20 >>> I have what might be a naive question. >>>=20 >>> People have told me that in Yang we want to separate functionality = from >>> technology, i.e. we will look at OAM, management, routing, signaling >>> and traffic engineering as aggregate functions and build our tree = based >>> on that. >>>=20 >>> Now if we are to model thing that are closely related e.g. MPLS OAM, >>> signaling, routing and traffic engineering, does that mean that we = have >>> to work at separate pieces of the yang tree and repeat this for = every >>> piece of the technology? >>=20 >> I think you can do a model dedicated to MPLS OAM. The analogy = is >> pretty much similar to how MIBs are created. You can import bits or >> objects from all over the place to create things, or you can recreate = them >> in place. There is a trade-off about modularity versus = time-to-completion >> here and I very much am not in favor of being zealous one way or the = other. >>=20 >> We also need to very much take an iterative process around these = models: >> they are not set in stone, and we should iterate on them to modify, = adapt >> and update them as necessary. With that in mind, we've been = encouraging people to >> just starting writing them as best as possible and implementing = either prototype >> code or actually putting them into products so that we can see how = they actually >> operate in the wild. >=20 > I thought there were activities going on to define an overall IETF = yang > model, right? If we say we approach this in an iterative way would the > overall yang-model be the outcome of that process, rather than an = input > to it. Or do I miss something? There is no such thing as an overall model; we have models that = fit together. The hope is that the output is a model, but assuming it will = never evolve is very much an old way of thinking about how modern software = engineering works. Artifacts are ephemeral and adapt/evolve or are sidelined = quickly.=20 --Tom >=20 > /Loa >>=20 >> --Tom >>=20 >>=20 >>> First, is this correctly understood or do I have to go back and = discuss >>> this again with the people proposing it? >>>=20 >>> If it is correct why is it superior to what we did for SNMP, one = MIB-module for each protocol? >>>=20 >>> Are the decisions taken or is the jury still out? >>>=20 >>> /Loa >>> -- >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com >>> Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu >>> Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >>> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >>>=20 >>=20 >=20 > --=20 >=20 >=20 > Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com > Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu > Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 >=20 From nobody Fri Feb 6 14:42:39 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B13C1A8792; Fri, 6 Feb 2015 14:42:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.054 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.054 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DOS_OUTLOOK_TO_MX=2.845, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iRbFY_8NNWXV; Fri, 6 Feb 2015 14:42:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from hickoryhill-consulting.com (hhc-web3.hickoryhill-consulting.com [64.9.205.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BFC61A6F96; Fri, 6 Feb 2015 14:42:34 -0800 (PST) X-Default-Received-SPF: pass (skip=forwardok (res=PASS)) x-ip-name=74.43.47.92; From: "Susan Hares" To: "idr wg" References: <1129100539.40053.1423259295222.JavaMail.nobody@jva2tc102.webex.com> In-Reply-To: <1129100539.40053.1423259295222.JavaMail.nobody@jva2tc102.webex.com> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2015 17:42:21 -0500 Message-ID: <01d101d0425e$2d271740$877545c0$@ndzh.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01D2_01D04234.44563F60" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQIyIa+OW8V9HkmziikvEba5jtd8kpwgdpuw Content-Language: en-us X-Authenticated-User: skh@ndzh.com Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org, NETCONF , netmod@ietf.org Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2015 22:42:37 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01D2_01D04234.44563F60 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_01D3_01D04234.44563F60" ------=_NextPart_001_01D3_01D04234.44563F60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable IDR WG will hold an interim on 2/9/2015 that focuses on BGP Yang = modules. The agenda is below.=20 =20 Sue Hares and John Scudder=20 =20 --------- =20 Agenda: (75 minutes 10:00 - 11:15am) =20 1) A review of draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00 (Keyur Patel) [30 minutes]=20 =20 2) Overview of Policy Yang drafts in IETF (Sue Hares) [10 minutes]=20 =20 Other policy drafts to read=20 = http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-shaikh-rtgwg-policy-model-00 = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-netmod-acl-model/ = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-wang-netmod-yang-policy-dm/ = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hares-i2rs-bnp-info-model/ = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hareskini-i2rs-pbr-info-model/ =20 3) Discussion comparing 2 BGP Yang modules [30 minutes]=20 draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00=20 =20 = https://github.com/YangModels/yang/tree/master/experimental/openconfig =20 =20 From: IDR Working Group [mailto:messenger@webex.com]=20 Sent: Friday, February 06, 2015 4:48 PM To: shares@ndzh.com Subject: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules =20 Hello,=20 IDR Working Group invites you to join this WebEx meeting.=20 =20 =20 =20 IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules=20 Monday, February 9, 2015=20 10:00 am | Eastern Standard Time (New York, GMT-05:00) | 2 hrs=20 =20 =20 =20 = Join WebEx meeting=20 =20 Meeting number:=20 646 680 229=20 Meeting password: bgpyang =20 =20 =20 Join by phone 1-877-668-4493 Call-in toll free number (US/Canada) 1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number (US/Canada) Access code: 646 680 229 Toll-free calling = restrictions =20 =20 =20 = Add this meeting to your calendar. =20 =20 =20 Can't join the meeting? Contact = support.=20 =20 =20 =20 IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please note that this WebEx service allows audio and = other information sent during the session to be recorded, which may be = discoverable in a legal matter. By joining this session, you = automatically consent to such recordings. If you do not consent to being = recorded, discuss your concerns with the host or do not join the = session. =20 ------=_NextPart_001_01D3_01D04234.44563F60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

IDR WG will hold an interim on 2/9/2015 that focuses on BGP Yang = modules.=C2=A0 =C2=A0The agenda is below.

 

Sue Hares and John Scudder

 

---------

 

Agenda: (75 minutes 10:00 - 11:15am)=C2=A0

1) A review of draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00 (Keyur Patel) [30 = minutes]

 

2) Overview of Policy Yang drafts in IETF (Sue Hares) [10 minutes] =

 

Other policy drafts to read

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-shaikh-rtgwg-policy-model-00<= /span>

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-netmod-acl-model/

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-wang-netmod-yang-policy-dm/

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hares-i2rs-bnp-info-model/

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hareskini-i2rs-pbr-info-model/=

 

3) Discussion comparing 2 BGP Yang modules [30 minutes] =

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00 =

 

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = https://github.com/YangModels/yang/tree/master/experimental/openconfig

 

 

From:= = IDR Working Group [mailto:messenger@webex.com]
Sent: Friday, = February 06, 2015 4:48 PM
To: = shares@ndzh.com
Subject: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim = 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules

 

Hello,

IDR Working Group invites you to join this WebEx meeting. =

 

 

 

IDR Interim 2/9 = - BGP Yang Modules =

Monday, February 9, 2015

10:00 am  |  Eastern Standard Time (New York, = GMT-05:00)  |  2 hrs =

 

 

 

Join = WebEx meeting =

 

Meeting number:

646 680 229

Meeting password:

bgpyang

 

 

 

Join by = phone

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1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number = (US/Canada)

Access code: 646 680 229

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Add this = meeting to your = calendar.

 

 

 

Can't join the meeting? Contact support. =

 

 

 

= IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please note that this WebEx service allows audio and = other information sent during the session to be recorded, which may be = discoverable in a legal matter. By joining this session, you = automatically consent to such recordings. If you do not consent to being = recorded, discuss your concerns with the host or do not join the = session.

 

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Join WebEx = meeting =
Meeting number: 646 680 = 229
Meeting = password:bgpyang
 
 
Join by = phone 
1-877-668-4493 Call-in toll free = number (US/Canada) 
1-650-479-3208 Call-in toll number = (US/Canada) 
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Can't join the = meeting? Contact support. =  
 
IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please note that this WebEx service = allows audio and other information sent during the session to be = recorded, which may be discoverable in a legal matter. By joining this = session, you automatically consent to such recordings. If you do not = consent to being recorded, discuss your concerns with the host or do not = join the session.
=0A= SUMMARY:IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules=0A= PRIORITY:5=0A= CLASS:PUBLIC=0A= BEGIN:VALARM=0A= TRIGGER:-PT5M=0A= ACTION:DISPLAY=0A= DESCRIPTION:Reminder=0A= END:VALARM=0A= END:VEVENT=0A= END:VCALENDAR=0A= ------=_NextPart_000_01D2_01D04234.44563F60-- From nobody Sat Feb 7 06:49:59 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA5051A8735; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 06:48:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -16.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-16.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pCD7ssjIPJhn; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 06:48:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from alln-iport-7.cisco.com (alln-iport-7.cisco.com [173.37.142.94]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 17D331A8731; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 06:48:24 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=491; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1423320504; x=1424530104; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:content-id:content-transfer-encoding: mime-version; bh=XgU3GPNTHQq2fv15ivCYBbae6zwDgQSLVRns6+wnaW0=; b=gTYaO3dvNq5JZofQxKmpVFbminotOHXTYMV8k691/zuE+yXy4dhX9BD+ /BrAi/ifPz7BJIFhcGmIIe+9hneNnrX/6L/x+M65uOw/+brHdYh5CLEfq RwC+easGARehyyIeXYqLr0cjv784/ZO2rO5Efq1Z3IdkrJyZKLIbRpTHu 8=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0A/BQCbJNZU/4ENJK1bgwZSWgTCcgqFJ0oCgQ9DAQEBAQEBfIQMAQEBBAEBATc0CxACAQgYHhAnCxwJAgQBDQWILQ3PPgEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBARMEjEgBgy8HhCoBBI8biSyScCKCDyOBPG+BRH4BAQE X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,535,1418083200"; d="scan'208";a="121483980" Received: from alln-core-9.cisco.com ([173.36.13.129]) by alln-iport-7.cisco.com with ESMTP; 07 Feb 2015 14:48:23 +0000 Received: from xhc-rcd-x03.cisco.com (xhc-rcd-x03.cisco.com [173.37.183.77]) by alln-core-9.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t17EmNW4024643 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sat, 7 Feb 2015 14:48:23 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.118]) by xhc-rcd-x03.cisco.com ([173.37.183.77]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 08:48:23 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" , Susan Hares , idr wg Thread-Topic: [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules Thread-Index: AQHQQr8Dw4Yj9R/hCUyYBX1U1m3HoZzlRMMA Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2015 14:48:22 +0000 Message-ID: References: <1129100539.40053.1423259295222.JavaMail.nobody@jva2tc102.webex.com> <01d101d0425e$2d271740$877545c0$@ndzh.com> <54D5D041.5070307@bwijnen.net> In-Reply-To: <54D5D041.5070307@bwijnen.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.24.185.175] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <2609C62857BBC14196B149647A39CF38@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , NETCONF , "netmod@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2015 14:48:25 -0000 Hi Bert, If you look at the WebEx, it is 10 AM EST (GMT - 5). Acee=20 On 2/7/15, 2:43 AM, "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" wrote: >On 06/02/15 23:42, Susan Hares wrote: >> Agenda: (75 minutes 10:00 - 11:15am) >any specifics on time zone? > >we are operating in an INTERNATIONAL/AROUND-THE-GLOB setting, are we not? > >Bert > >_______________________________________________ >netmod mailing list >netmod@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod From nobody Sat Feb 7 08:33:24 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86ED81A1AEA; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 08:28:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.055 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.055 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DOS_OUTLOOK_TO_MX=2.845, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ez6SrlgQlGUc; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 08:28:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from hickoryhill-consulting.com (hhc-web3.hickoryhill-consulting.com [64.9.205.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C1D51A0084; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 08:28:49 -0800 (PST) X-Default-Received-SPF: pass (skip=loggedin (res=PASS)) x-ip-name=74.43.47.92; From: "Susan Hares" To: "'Acee Lindem \(acee\)'" , "'Bert Wijnen \(IETF\)'" , "'idr wg'" References: <1129100539.40053.1423259295222.JavaMail.nobody@jva2tc102.webex.com> <01d101d0425e$2d271740$877545c0$@ndzh.com> <54D5D041.5070307@bwijnen.net> In-Reply-To: Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2015 11:28:40 -0500 Message-ID: <003001d042f3$22c77ed0$68567c70$@ndzh.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQIyIa+OW8V9HkmziikvEba5jtd8kgJZ/j75Awex5hcBDXZmPJvuKZaQ Content-Language: en-us X-Authenticated-User: skh@ndzh.com Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org, 'NETCONF' , netmod@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2015 16:28:51 -0000 Bert: 10 - 11:30 am ET. My apologies for missing it. Sue -----Original Message----- From: Acee Lindem (acee) [mailto:acee@cisco.com] Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 9:48 AM To: Bert Wijnen (IETF); Susan Hares; idr wg Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org; NETCONF; netmod@ietf.org Subject: Re: [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules Hi Bert, If you look at the WebEx, it is 10 AM EST (GMT - 5). Acee On 2/7/15, 2:43 AM, "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" wrote: >On 06/02/15 23:42, Susan Hares wrote: >> Agenda: (75 minutes 10:00 - 11:15am) >any specifics on time zone? > >we are operating in an INTERNATIONAL/AROUND-THE-GLOB setting, are we not? > >Bert > >_______________________________________________ >netmod mailing list >netmod@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod From nobody Sun Feb 8 02:26:27 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C8BB1A1AFB for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2015 02:26:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5T54T05po1bi for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2015 02:26:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from pipi.pi.nu (pipi.pi.nu [83.168.239.141]) (using TLSv1.1 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 10E0D1A005A for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2015 02:26:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.12] (unknown [49.149.205.111]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: loa@pi.nu) by pipi.pi.nu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 230B81801127; Sun, 8 Feb 2015 11:26:19 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <54D739C4.6070705@pi.nu> Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2015 18:26:12 +0800 From: Loa Andersson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Thomas D. Nadeau" References: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> <54D44C11.2080902@pi.nu> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2015 10:26:25 -0000 Tom, On 2015-02-07 00:32, Thomas D. Nadeau wrote: > There is no such thing as an overall model; we have models that fit > together. The hope is that the output is a model, but assuming it will never > evolve is very much an old way of thinking about how modern software engineering > works. Artifacts are ephemeral and adapt/evolve or are sidelined quickly. What is the exact difference between "overall model" and "models that fit together", isn't the essence of "fitting together" some sort of overall-ness? This seems to be what e.g. the LIME charter says - "...it is the intention that the generic information and data models produced by the working group should be applicable to multiple layers and technologies in a technology agnostic fashion..." /Loa > > --Tom -- Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 From nobody Mon Feb 9 10:06:09 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A2A91A1A6A; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 00:43:52 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OyI_5sE2K77m; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 00:43:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from lb2-smtp-cloud3.xs4all.net (lb2-smtp-cloud3.xs4all.net [194.109.24.26]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 187B21A8938; Sat, 7 Feb 2015 00:43:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from Macintosh-6.fritz.box ([83.163.239.181]) by smtp-cloud3.xs4all.net with ESMTP id pLjl1p00G3vXPcr01LjnYu; Sat, 07 Feb 2015 09:43:47 +0100 Message-ID: <54D5D041.5070307@bwijnen.net> Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2015 09:43:45 +0100 From: "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.10; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Susan Hares , idr wg References: <1129100539.40053.1423259295222.JavaMail.nobody@jva2tc102.webex.com> <01d101d0425e$2d271740$877545c0$@ndzh.com> In-Reply-To: <01d101d0425e$2d271740$877545c0$@ndzh.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 09 Feb 2015 10:03:22 -0800 Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org, NETCONF , netmod@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2015 08:43:52 -0000 On 06/02/15 23:42, Susan Hares wrote: > Agenda: (75 minutes 10:00 - 11:15am) any specifics on time zone? we are operating in an INTERNATIONAL/AROUND-THE-GLOB setting, are we not? Bert From nobody Mon Feb 9 10:07:51 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C5B51A0091; Mon, 9 Feb 2015 00:29:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WqiFFcAlpwkG; Mon, 9 Feb 2015 00:29:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from lb1-smtp-cloud3.xs4all.net (lb1-smtp-cloud3.xs4all.net [194.109.24.22]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5DBB91A007E; Mon, 9 Feb 2015 00:29:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from Macintosh-6.fritz.box ([83.163.239.181]) by smtp-cloud3.xs4all.net with ESMTP id q8VY1p00E3vXPcr018VZeP; Mon, 09 Feb 2015 09:29:36 +0100 Message-ID: <54D86FEC.6030004@bwijnen.net> Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2015 09:29:32 +0100 From: "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.10; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Susan Hares , "'Acee Lindem (acee)'" , 'idr wg' References: <1129100539.40053.1423259295222.JavaMail.nobody@jva2tc102.webex.com> <01d101d0425e$2d271740$877545c0$@ndzh.com> <54D5D041.5070307@bwijnen.net> <003001d042f3$22c77ed0$68567c70$@ndzh.com> In-Reply-To: <003001d042f3$22c77ed0$68567c70$@ndzh.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 09 Feb 2015 10:03:22 -0800 Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org, 'NETCONF' , netmod@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2015 08:29:43 -0000 On 07/02/15 17:28, Susan Hares wrote: > Bert: > > 10 - 11:30 am ET. My apologies for missing it. No problem. That time is probably difficult or impossible for me. Bert > Sue > > -----Original Message----- > From: Acee Lindem (acee) [mailto:acee@cisco.com] > Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 9:48 AM > To: Bert Wijnen (IETF); Susan Hares; idr wg > Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org; NETCONF; netmod@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim > 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules > > Hi Bert, > > If you look at the WebEx, it is 10 AM EST (GMT - 5). > > Acee > > On 2/7/15, 2:43 AM, "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" wrote: > >> On 06/02/15 23:42, Susan Hares wrote: >>> Agenda: (75 minutes 10:00 - 11:15am) >> any specifics on time zone? >> >> we are operating in an INTERNATIONAL/AROUND-THE-GLOB setting, are we not? >> >> Bert >> >> _______________________________________________ >> netmod mailing list >> netmod@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > > From nobody Tue Feb 10 04:26:37 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 881E41A01E7; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 04:26:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.102 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.102 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jujMeIUbm79k; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 04:26:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from relais-inet.francetelecom.com (relais-ias91.francetelecom.com [193.251.215.91]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1A85F1A019B; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 04:26:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from omfedm08.si.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.4]) by omfedm10.si.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id 45A2E26404F; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 13:26:01 +0100 (CET) Received: from Exchangemail-eme2.itn.ftgroup (unknown [10.114.31.30]) by omfedm08.si.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id D8EA2238067; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 13:26:00 +0100 (CET) Received: from OPEXCLILM34.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([169.254.4.53]) by OPEXCLILH02.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([10.114.31.30]) with mapi id 14.03.0224.002; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 13:26:00 +0100 From: To: "ospf@ietf.org" , "isis-wg@ietf.org list (isis-wg@ietf.org)" , "mpls@ietf.org" , "idr@ietf.org" , "rtgwg@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Survey for YANG model design : routing protocols CLI implementation Thread-Index: AdBFLLfJ87T7mg7qSBKOVExsw2JGuw== Importance: high X-Priority: 1 Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 12:26:00 +0000 Message-ID: <12023_1423571161_54D9F8D8_12023_1801_1_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7A0F1A@OPEXCLILM34.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.168.234.1] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="_006_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7A0F1AOPEXCLILM34corp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-PMX-Version: 6.0.3.2322014, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.2107409, Antispam-Data: 2014.12.16.112421 Archived-At: Cc: "Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] Survey for YANG model design : routing protocols CLI implementation X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 12:26:08 -0000 --_006_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7A0F1AOPEXCLILM34corp_ Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="_005_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7A0F1AOPEXCLILM34corp_"; type="multipart/alternative" --_005_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7A0F1AOPEXCLILM34corp_ Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7A0F1AOPEXCLILM34corp_" --_000_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7A0F1AOPEXCLILM34corp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Folks, A lot of us are currently working on Yang model drafts. In the framework of= routing protocols related drafts, we have some discussion regarding how to= model the configuration of routing protocols and especially do it need to = be routing-instance centric or protocol centric (see slides for quick expla= nation of the difference). This is a cross protocol discussion, as we would= like to apply the same design to all. In order to decide how to progress on this major design point, one point i= s to evaluate current implementations and how many are routing-instance cen= tric and protocol centric. The famous implementations are well known, but w= e would like to have a more global view. This metric would be one among oth= ers. In order to help us to do this inventory, could you please respond unicast = to me, if you are an implementor and you have an implementation of a routin= g-protocol (ISIS,OSPF,RIP,BGP, PIM ... but also MPLS-TE, LDP, RSVP ...) and= in this case, what is your CLI flavor ? Please use this sample format, so it would be easier for me to aggregate : (If you own multiple implementations, you can fill multiple lines.) Vendor OS Protocol Centric VRF centric Cisco IOS/IOS-XE X Thanks for your help ! [Orange logo] Stephane Litkowski Network Architect Orange/SCE/EQUANT/IBNF/ENDD/NDE Orange Expert Future Networks phone: +33 2 23 28 49 83 mobile: +33 6 37 86 97 52 stephane.litkowski@orange.com ___________________________________________________________________________= ______________________________________________ Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden= tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu= ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el= ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou = falsifie. Merci. This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf= ormation that may be protected by law; they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele= te this message and its attachments. As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been = modified, changed or falsified. Thank you. --_000_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF920C7A0F1AOPEXCLILM34corp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Folks,

 

A lot of us are currently working on Yang model draf= ts. In the framework of routing protocols related drafts, we have some disc= ussion regarding how to model the configuration of routing protocols and es= pecially do it need to be routing-instance centric or protocol centric (see slides for quick explanation of the diffe= rence). This is a cross protocol discussion, as we would like to apply the = same design to all.

 

In order to decide how to progress on this major des= ign point, one point  is to evaluate current implementations and how m= any are routing-instance centric and protocol centric. The famous implement= ations are well known, but we would like to have a more global view. This metric would be one among others.

 

In order to help us to do this inventory, could you = please respond unicast to me, if you are an implementor and you have an imp= lementation of a routing-protocol (ISIS,OSPF,RIP,BGP, PIM … but also = MPLS-TE, LDP, RSVP …) and in this case, what is your CLI flavor ?

 

Please use this sample format, so it would be easier= for me to aggregate :

(If you own multiple implementations, you can fill m= ultiple lines.)

 

 

Vendor

OS<= /b>

Protocol Centric

VRF centric

Cisco<= /p>

IOS/IOS-XE

X

 

 

 

Thanks for your help !

 

 

3D"O=

 <= o:p>

Stephane Litkowski
Network Architect
Orange/SCE/EQUANT/IBNF/ENDD/NDE

Orange Expert Fut= ure Networks

phone: +33 2 23 28 49 83
mobile: +33 6 37 86 97 52
stephane.litkowski@orange.com

 

 

______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been =
modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.
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08:03:33 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB5A11A1A12; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 08:03:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -16.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-16.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bKglbwDda2Ro; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 08:03:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from rcdn-iport-3.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-3.cisco.com [173.37.86.74]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A3F9F1A19E9; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 08:03:26 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=1440; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1423584206; x=1424793806; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding:mime-version; bh=bzO8NwTHpA4VZ8I6QTmXa2FR6pyhXRp3F8tdJ71Jwp0=; b=VHaWc5g86GoAMLR5zvge2ik3qcbeeX5mAWA4OsdAV4ZK3d7dGtRH6CEJ 5ETofIPq9rouXagWO7PWXNux5XR1b3GgFgLl17SLIStsjAi+f5Q9AgJnh hDc8ZPgsICBxwoTwqkLeSOtYSoKp8uHaox3U6WMS1b25mhMmkhpgSSner I=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AlcFAEsr2lStJV2b/2dsb2JhbABcgmQiUlrDCQqFJ0oCgSBDAQEBAQEBfIQMAQEBAwEBAQE3NAsFBwQCAQgRBAEBAR4FBAcnCxQIAQgCBA4FiCUIAQzQbgEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBARMEjEcBgnwzBwaDEIEUBY8giS6SdiKCDyOBPG+CQgEBAQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,551,1418083200"; d="scan'208";a="394963466" Received: from rcdn-core-4.cisco.com ([173.37.93.155]) by rcdn-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP; 10 Feb 2015 16:03:26 +0000 Received: from xhc-aln-x10.cisco.com (xhc-aln-x10.cisco.com [173.36.12.84]) by rcdn-core-4.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t1AG3P68008628 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Tue, 10 Feb 2015 16:03:25 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x02.cisco.com ([fe80::8c1c:7b85:56de:ffd1]) by xhc-aln-x10.cisco.com ([173.36.12.84]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:03:25 -0600 From: "Ken Gray (kegray)" To: "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules Thread-Index: AQHQQuUmr547mvx02kSiTTavp01geJzlxQ0AgAKezACAAayQIA== Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 16:03:25 +0000 Message-ID: References: <1129100539.40053.1423259295222.JavaMail.nobody@jva2tc102.webex.com> <01d101d0425e$2d271740$877545c0$@ndzh.com> <54D5D041.5070307@bwijnen.net> <003001d042f3$22c77ed0$68567c70$@ndzh.com>,<54D86FEC.6030004@bwijnen.net> In-Reply-To: <54D86FEC.6030004@bwijnen.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , idr wg , "netmod@ietf.org" , NETCONF , "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Susan Hares Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 16:03:31 -0000 Recorded by chance? Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 9, 2015, at 1:03 PM, "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" wro= te: >=20 >> On 07/02/15 17:28, Susan Hares wrote: >> Bert: >>=20 >> 10 - 11:30 am ET. My apologies for missing it. >=20 > No problem. That time is probably difficult or impossible for me. >=20 > Bert >> Sue >>=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Acee Lindem (acee) [mailto:acee@cisco.com] >> Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 9:48 AM >> To: Bert Wijnen (IETF); Susan Hares; idr wg >> Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org; NETCONF; netmod@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interi= m >> 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules >>=20 >> Hi Bert, >>=20 >> If you look at the WebEx, it is 10 AM EST (GMT - 5). >>=20 >> Acee >>=20 >>> On 2/7/15, 2:43 AM, "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" wrote: >>>=20 >>>> On 06/02/15 23:42, Susan Hares wrote: >>>> Agenda: (75 minutes 10:00 - 11:15am) >>> any specifics on time zone? >>>=20 >>> we are operating in an INTERNATIONAL/AROUND-THE-GLOB setting, are we no= t? >>>=20 >>> Bert >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> netmod mailing list >>> netmod@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Rtg-yang-coord mailing list > Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord From nobody Tue Feb 10 10:07:38 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 732941A02F1; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:07:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w95Lo9od8gYo; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:07:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from emea01-am1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-am1on0702.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe00::702]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 45F651A06FD; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 10:07:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from pc6 (81.151.167.59) by DBXPR07MB063.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.242.147.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.75.20; Tue, 10 Feb 2015 18:07:08 +0000 Message-ID: <032701d0455c$27b622a0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> From: t.petch To: "Ken Gray (kegray)" References: <1129100539.40053.1423259295222.JavaMail.nobody@jva2tc102.webex.com> <01d101d0425e$2d271740$877545c0$@ndzh.com> <54D5D041.5070307@bwijnen.net> <003001d042f3$22c77ed0$68567c70$@ndzh.com>, <54D86FEC.6030004@bwijnen.net> Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 18:03:19 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Originating-IP: [81.151.167.59] X-ClientProxiedBy: DB4PR03CA0014.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.160.39.152) To DBXPR07MB063.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.242.147.22) Authentication-Results: cisco.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none; X-Microsoft-Antispam: UriScan:; X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DBXPR07MB063; X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-Test: UriScan:; X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-CFA-Test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(601004); SRVR:DBXPR07MB063; X-Forefront-PRVS: 048396AFA0 X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(51704005)(13464003)(24454002)(497574002)(377424004)(39224004)(479174004)(377454003)(44736004)(50466002)(66066001)(50226001)(122386002)(81686999)(19580405001)(86362001)(92566002)(40100003)(76176999)(47776003)(50986999)(23756003)(14496001)(81816999)(42186005)(33646002)(46102003)(77096005)(110136001)(87976001)(15975445007)(1720100001)(62236002)(44716002)(19580395003)(77156002)(230783001)(93886004)(116806002)(62966003)(74416001)(7726001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DBXPR07MB063; H:pc6; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; LANG:en; X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-CFA-Test: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DBXPR07MB063; X-OriginatorOrg: btconnect.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Feb 2015 18:07:08.2079 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DBXPR07MB063 Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org, idr wg , NETCONF , netmod@ietf.org, Susan Hares Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2015 18:07:29 -0000 You could try http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/interim/2015/02/09/idr/minutes/minutes-i nterim-2015-idr-3 On the other hand, nothing has yet appeared for the meeting scheduled for 2015-1-12:-( Tom Petch ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Gray (kegray)" To: "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" Cc: ; "idr wg" ; ; "NETCONF" ; "Acee Lindem (acee)" ; "Susan Hares" Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2015 4:03 PM Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules > Recorded by chance? > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Feb 9, 2015, at 1:03 PM, "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" wrote: > > > >> On 07/02/15 17:28, Susan Hares wrote: > >> Bert: > >> > >> 10 - 11:30 am ET. My apologies for missing it. > > > > No problem. That time is probably difficult or impossible for me. > > > > Bert > >> Sue > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Acee Lindem (acee) [mailto:acee@cisco.com] > >> Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2015 9:48 AM > >> To: Bert Wijnen (IETF); Susan Hares; idr wg > >> Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org; NETCONF; netmod@ietf.org > >> Subject: Re: [netmod] [Netconf] FW: WebEx meeting invitation: IDR Interim > >> 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules > >> > >> Hi Bert, > >> > >> If you look at the WebEx, it is 10 AM EST (GMT - 5). > >> > >> Acee > >> > >>> On 2/7/15, 2:43 AM, "Bert Wijnen (IETF)" wrote: > >>> > >>>> On 06/02/15 23:42, Susan Hares wrote: > >>>> Agenda: (75 minutes 10:00 - 11:15am) > >>> any specifics on time zone? > >>> > >>> we are operating in an INTERNATIONAL/AROUND-THE-GLOB setting, are we not? > >>> > >>> Bert > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> netmod mailing list > >>> netmod@ietf.org > >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rtg-yang-coord mailing list > > Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord > > _______________________________________________ > Rtg-yang-coord mailing list > Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord From nobody Wed Feb 11 04:51:29 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E20761A8880 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 04:51:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TvMxzfE3KUtk for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 04:51:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from emea01-am1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-am1on0730.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe00::730]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4E3481A888C for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 04:51:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from DB3PR07MB059.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.242.137.149) by DB3PR07MB0524.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (25.160.44.16) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.87.18; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:46:24 +0000 Received: from pc6 (81.151.167.59) by DB3PR07MB059.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.242.137.149) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.81.19; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:46:23 +0000 Message-ID: <01d201d045f8$82b5c1a0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> From: t.petch To: "Thomas D. Nadeau" , Loa Andersson References: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:44:34 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Originating-IP: [81.151.167.59] X-ClientProxiedBy: DB4PR03CA0011.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.160.39.149) To DB3PR07MB059.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.242.137.149) Authentication-Results: lucidvision.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none; X-Microsoft-Antispam: UriScan:;UriScan:; X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DB3PR07MB059; X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-Test: UriScan:; X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-CFA-Test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(601004); SRVR:DB3PR07MB059; X-Forefront-PRVS: 0484063412 X-Forefront-Antispam-Report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(51704005)(377454003)(252514010)(24454002)(13464003)(19580405001)(19580395003)(87976001)(50226001)(61296003)(44736004)(42186005)(40100003)(116806002)(33646002)(122386002)(230783001)(46102003)(47776003)(44716002)(77156002)(62966003)(66066001)(77096005)(86362001)(81816999)(81686999)(76176999)(50986999)(23756003)(50466002)(15975445007)(1456003)(92566002)(74416001)(7726001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DB3PR07MB059; H:pc6; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; LANG:en; X-Exchange-Antispam-Report-CFA-Test: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DB3PR07MB059; X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2015 12:46:23.7633 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-FromEntityHeader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DB3PR07MB059 X-Microsoft-Antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DB3PR07MB0524; X-OriginatorOrg: btconnect.com Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:51:28 -0000 ---- Original Message ----- From: "Thomas D. Nadeau" To: "Loa Andersson" Cc: Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2015 12:27 PM > > > On Feb 5, 2015:5:51 AM, at 5:51 AM, Loa Andersson wrote: > > > > I have what might be a naive question. > > > > People have told me that in Yang we want to separate functionality from > > technology, i.e. we will look at OAM, management, routing, signaling > > and traffic engineering as aggregate functions and build our tree based > > on that. > > > > Now if we are to model thing that are closely related e.g. MPLS OAM, > > signaling, routing and traffic engineering, does that mean that we have > > to work at separate pieces of the yang tree and repeat this for every > > piece of the technology? > > I think you can do a model dedicated to MPLS OAM. The analogy is > pretty much similar to how MIBs are created. You can import bits or > objects from all over the place to create things, or you can recreate them > in place. There is a trade-off about modularity versus time-to-completion > here and I very much am not in favor of being zealous one way or the other. > > We also need to very much take an iterative process around these models: > they are not set in stone, and we should iterate on them to modify, adapt > and update them as necessary. With that in mind, we've been encouraging people to > just starting writing them as best as possible and implementing either prototype > code or actually putting them into products so that we can see how they actually > operate in the wild. Loa I do not think the question naive, but I do think it a management question, rather than a technical one. And as a wise consultant kept reminding me (the consumate technician:-), there are management solutions to technical problems but never technical solutions to management ones. Like structuring and restructuring IETF working groups, there are many ways to make it work but it is about management, not technology (or functionality). So I would prefer a YANG module that matches the skills of a Working Group, not needing cross-WG review. I think that the problem with MIB Modules was and is a lack of knowledge of management in general and of SNMP in particular, within any working group (e.g. IDR) and that is likely to be true with YANG but at least a WG should be familiar with the technology and have a sense of which elements to include in a data or information model, even if the WG lacks the skills to turn it into YANG. SNMP does have conformance which made it possible to create the one MIB Module with basic, intermediate and advanced subsets. YANG lacks that but has if-feature which I see as complicated, easy to get wrong both in terms of getting the statement correct with respect to the logic that has been agreed, and in choosing when to use it or not. (A bit like novice programmers who learn that when two or three statements appear more than once, they can be replaced by a procedure or function, making the code shorter and harder to understand and maintain). I suspect that if-feature is much over-used and that the cost of that will become apparent in a few years time. Tom Petch > --Tom > > > > First, is this correctly understood or do I have to go back and discuss > > this again with the people proposing it? > > > > If it is correct why is it superior to what we did for SNMP, one MIB-module for each protocol? > > > > Are the decisions taken or is the jury still out? > > > > /Loa > > -- > > > > > > Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com > > Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu > > Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rtg-yang-coord mailing list > > Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rtg-yang-coord mailing list > Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord > From nobody Wed Feb 11 05:20:56 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAA481A8889 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 05:20:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.302 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.302 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_15=0.6, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YjUBGN9Jz8R3 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 05:20:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from na01-bn1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-bn1bon0727.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fc10::1:727]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D7C321A8899 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 05:20:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from BN1PR05MB424.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.141.58.148) by BN1PR05MB424.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.141.58.148) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.75.20; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:20:20 +0000 Received: from BN1PR05MB424.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([169.254.8.245]) by BN1PR05MB424.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([169.254.8.245]) with mapi id 15.01.0075.002; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:20:20 +0000 From: Dean Bogdanovic To: t.petch Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? Thread-Index: AQHQQTHL+ah4Tmhuxk6HqEDGhBwUyZzh+7aAgAl02IKAAAgCgA== Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:20:20 +0000 Message-ID: <609F074B-1B65-4E04-8696-BCF50CBCAC96@juniper.net> References: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> <01d201d045f8$82b5c1a0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> In-Reply-To: <01d201d045f8$82b5c1a0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-mailer: Apple Mail (2.1510) x-originating-ip: [66.129.241.12] authentication-results: btconnect.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none; x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:BN1PR05MB424; x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:BN1PR05MB424; x-forefront-prvs: 0484063412 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(13464003)(24454002)(51704005)(377454003)(252514010)(66066001)(2656002)(77156002)(62966003)(92566002)(2900100001)(2950100001)(33656002)(110136001)(46102003)(87936001)(15975445007)(19580395003)(230783001)(19580405001)(57306001)(36756003)(122556002)(83716003)(50226001)(82746002)(102836002)(40100003)(50986999)(106116001)(76176999)(86362001)(99286002)(7059030)(104396002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:BN1PR05MB424; H:BN1PR05MB424.namprd05.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; LANG:en; Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <5012D5EACEF7FE47AE2DF8A9EF40302A@namprd05.prod.outlook.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: juniper.net X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 11 Feb 2015 13:20:20.2395 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BN1PR05MB424 Archived-At: Cc: "Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , "Thomas D. Nadeau" , Loa Andersson Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:20:50 -0000 On Feb 11, 2015, at 7:44 AM, t.petch wrote: > ---- Original Message ----- > From: "Thomas D. Nadeau" > To: "Loa Andersson" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2015 12:27 PM >>=20 >>> On Feb 5, 2015:5:51 AM, at 5:51 AM, Loa Andersson wrote: >>>=20 >>> I have what might be a naive question. >>>=20 >>> People have told me that in Yang we want to separate functionality > from >>> technology, i.e. we will look at OAM, management, routing, signaling >>> and traffic engineering as aggregate functions and build our tree > based >>> on that. >>>=20 >>> Now if we are to model thing that are closely related e.g. MPLS OAM, >>> signaling, routing and traffic engineering, does that mean that we > have >>> to work at separate pieces of the yang tree and repeat this for > every >>> piece of the technology? >>=20 >> I think you can do a model dedicated to MPLS OAM. The analogy is >> pretty much similar to how MIBs are created. You can import bits or >> objects from all over the place to create things, or you can recreate > them >> in place. There is a trade-off about modularity versus > time-to-completion >> here and I very much am not in favor of being zealous one way or the > other. >>=20 >> We also need to very much take an iterative process around these > models: >> they are not set in stone, and we should iterate on them to modify, > adapt >> and update them as necessary. With that in mind, we've been > encouraging people to >> just starting writing them as best as possible and implementing either > prototype >> code or actually putting them into products so that we can see how > they actually >> operate in the wild. >=20 > Loa >=20 > I do not think the question naive, but I do think it a management > question, rather than a technical one. And as a wise consultant kept > reminding me (the consumate technician:-), there are management > solutions to technical problems but never technical solutions to > management ones. >=20 > Like structuring and restructuring IETF working groups, there are many > ways to make it work but it is about management, not technology (or > functionality). So I would prefer a YANG module that matches the skills > of a Working Group, not needing cross-WG review. Matching YANG models with WG is nice to have, but not always possible, as s= ome models (e.g. access control list) don't have a WG to fit in. I believe = some other models will come up as well. As long there is an active WG, the = modeling work should be done within that group. >=20 > I think that the problem with MIB Modules was and is a lack of knowledge > of management in general and of SNMP in particular, within any working > group (e.g. IDR) and that is likely to be true with YANG but at least a > WG should be familiar with the technology and have a sense of which > elements to include in a data or information model, even if the WG lacks > the skills to turn it into YANG. >=20 > SNMP does have conformance which made it possible to create the one MIB > Module with basic, intermediate and advanced subsets. YANG lacks that > but has if-feature which I see as complicated, easy to get wrong both in > terms of getting the statement correct with respect to the logic that > has been agreed, and in choosing when to use it or not. (A bit like > novice programmers who learn that when two or three statements appear > more than once, they can be replaced by a procedure or function, making > the code shorter and harder to understand and maintain). I suspect that > if-feature is much over-used and that the cost of that will become > apparent in a few years time. One of YANG strong sides is the extensibility and augmentation. If-feature = is very useful, but it should be carefully used. A much better way to desig= n YANG models is using following base model standard extension model proprietary extension model With base model, a basic set of features is described. That model can be th= en imported into another model, like standard or proprietary extension mode= l, and augmented with more features. This provides easier to read and maint= enance of the code. Take a look at draft-ietf-netmod-acl-model for example. Dean >=20 > Tom Petch >=20 >> --Tom >>=20 >>=20 >>> First, is this correctly understood or do I have to go back and > discuss >>> this again with the people proposing it? >>>=20 >>> If it is correct why is it superior to what we did for SNMP, one > MIB-module for each protocol? >>>=20 >>> Are the decisions taken or is the jury still out? >>>=20 >>> /Loa >>> -- >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com >>> Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu >>> Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >>> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >>>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Rtg-yang-coord mailing list > Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord From nobody Wed Feb 11 05:26:15 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B8F11A88A3 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 05:26:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 1.495 X-Spam-Level: * X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.495 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, J_CHICKENPOX_15=0.6, RDNS_NONE=0.793, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZHdnNM9J9trs for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 05:26:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from lucidvision.com (unknown [50.255.148.178]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 292411A020B for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 05:26:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.134] (unknown [50.255.148.177]) by lucidvision.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76A242E422CB; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 08:26:11 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2070.6\)) From: "Thomas D. Nadeau" In-Reply-To: <609F074B-1B65-4E04-8696-BCF50CBCAC96@juniper.net> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 08:26:12 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <45D497EE-BBBB-4F8D-806E-77E445041AEE@lucidvision.com> References: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> <01d201d045f8$82b5c1a0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> <609F074B-1B65-4E04-8696-BCF50CBCAC96@juniper.net> To: Dean Bogdanovic X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2070.6) Archived-At: Cc: "Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , "t.petch" , Loa Andersson Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:26:14 -0000 > On Feb 11, 2015:8:20 AM, at 8:20 AM, Dean Bogdanovic = wrote: >=20 >=20 > On Feb 11, 2015, at 7:44 AM, t.petch wrote: >=20 >> ---- Original Message ----- >> From: "Thomas D. Nadeau" >> To: "Loa Andersson" >> Cc: >> Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2015 12:27 PM >>>=20 >>>> On Feb 5, 2015:5:51 AM, at 5:51 AM, Loa Andersson = wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> I have what might be a naive question. >>>>=20 >>>> People have told me that in Yang we want to separate functionality >> from >>>> technology, i.e. we will look at OAM, management, routing, = signaling >>>> and traffic engineering as aggregate functions and build our tree >> based >>>> on that. >>>>=20 >>>> Now if we are to model thing that are closely related e.g. MPLS = OAM, >>>> signaling, routing and traffic engineering, does that mean that we >> have >>>> to work at separate pieces of the yang tree and repeat this for >> every >>>> piece of the technology? >>>=20 >>> I think you can do a model dedicated to MPLS OAM. The analogy is >>> pretty much similar to how MIBs are created. You can import bits or >>> objects from all over the place to create things, or you can = recreate >> them >>> in place. There is a trade-off about modularity versus >> time-to-completion >>> here and I very much am not in favor of being zealous one way or the >> other. >>>=20 >>> We also need to very much take an iterative process around these >> models: >>> they are not set in stone, and we should iterate on them to modify, >> adapt >>> and update them as necessary. With that in mind, we've been >> encouraging people to >>> just starting writing them as best as possible and implementing = either >> prototype >>> code or actually putting them into products so that we can see how >> they actually >>> operate in the wild. >>=20 >> Loa >>=20 >> I do not think the question naive, but I do think it a management >> question, rather than a technical one. And as a wise consultant kept >> reminding me (the consumate technician:-), there are management >> solutions to technical problems but never technical solutions to >> management ones. >>=20 >> Like structuring and restructuring IETF working groups, there are = many >> ways to make it work but it is about management, not technology (or >> functionality). So I would prefer a YANG module that matches the = skills >> of a Working Group, not needing cross-WG review. >=20 > Matching YANG models with WG is nice to have, but not always possible, = as some models (e.g. access control list) don't have a WG to fit in. I = believe some other models will come up as well. As long there is an = active WG, the modeling work should be done within that group. =09 And that is my point exactly. We should not be spinning up = special WGs to do Yang models; its unnecessary. The added process = overhead is not worth it. If there is another WG like netmod/conf/ops = area/whatever that roughly makes sense put it there. If there is not = enough management bandwidth, go ahead and (temporarily?) add another = chair or secretary. IMHO we need to stop focusing on spinning up new = WGs, and instead focus on actually getting work done regardless of = where. > I think that the problem with MIB Modules was and is a lack of = knowledge >> of management in general and of SNMP in particular, within any = working >> group (e.g. IDR) and that is likely to be true with YANG but at least = a >> WG should be familiar with the technology and have a sense of which >> elements to include in a data or information model, even if the WG = lacks >> the skills to turn it into YANG. >>=20 >> SNMP does have conformance which made it possible to create the one = MIB >> Module with basic, intermediate and advanced subsets. YANG lacks = that >> but has if-feature which I see as complicated, easy to get wrong both = in >> terms of getting the statement correct with respect to the logic that >> has been agreed, and in choosing when to use it or not. (A bit like >> novice programmers who learn that when two or three statements appear >> more than once, they can be replaced by a procedure or function, = making >> the code shorter and harder to understand and maintain). I suspect = that >> if-feature is much over-used and that the cost of that will become >> apparent in a few years time. >=20 > One of YANG strong sides is the extensibility and augmentation. = If-feature is very useful, but it should be carefully used. A much = better way to design YANG models is using following >=20 > base model > standard extension model > proprietary extension model >=20 > With base model, a basic set of features is described. That model can = be then imported into another model, like standard or proprietary = extension model, and augmented with more features. This provides easier = to read and maintenance of the code. Take a look at = draft-ietf-netmod-acl-model for example. >=20 > Dean +1. --Tom >=20 >>=20 >> Tom Petch >>=20 >>> --Tom >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>> First, is this correctly understood or do I have to go back and >> discuss >>>> this again with the people proposing it? >>>>=20 >>>> If it is correct why is it superior to what we did for SNMP, one >> MIB-module for each protocol? >>>>=20 >>>> Are the decisions taken or is the jury still out? >>>>=20 >>>> /Loa >>>> -- >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com >>>> Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu >>>> Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 >>>>=20 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >>>> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >>> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >>>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord >=20 >=20 From nobody Wed Feb 11 14:55:52 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56DB11A1B9E; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 14:55:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -99.054 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-99.054 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DOS_OUTLOOK_TO_MX=2.845, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OpdzwUz8ud9b; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 14:55:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from hickoryhill-consulting.com (hhc-web3.hickoryhill-consulting.com [64.9.205.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F5361A1A1E; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 14:55:44 -0800 (PST) X-Default-Received-SPF: pass (skip=forwardok (res=PASS)) x-ip-name=74.43.47.92; From: "Susan Hares" To: "idr wg" References: <1716926046.1975221423694292688.JavaMail.nobody@rva2rmd002.webex.com> In-Reply-To: <1716926046.1975221423694292688.JavaMail.nobody@rva2rmd002.webex.com> Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 17:55:35 -0500 Message-ID: <074c01d0464d$d92d11a0$8b8734e0$@ndzh.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_074D_01D04623.F057F400" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQHJ57GBwTjsxCJFcI4UebhxZCloJpz4yCiQ Content-Language: en-us X-Authenticated-User: skh@ndzh.com Archived-At: Cc: Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org, "'Ken Gray \(kegray\)'" , netmod@ietf.org, "'t.petch'" , NETCONF , "John G. Scudder" Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] FW: WebEx recording is available for viewing: IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules-20150209 1500-1 X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 22:55:46 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_074D_01D04623.F057F400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable IDR Working Group wants to share this WebEx recording with you.=20 IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules-20150209 1500-1=20 Monday, February 9, 2015=20 11:17 am | Eastern Standard Time (New York, GMT-05:00)=20 PLAY RECORDING (1 hr 8 min)=20 https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/ldr.php?RCID=3Ddad5cf872d4469f95ad00b0330f8e9= d8=20 This is the recording of the discussion of the BGP Yang modules. =20 = draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00 = draft-shaikh-idr-bgp-model-00=20 =20 Sue Hares=20 ------=_NextPart_000_074D_01D04623.F057F400 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


IDR = Working Group wants to share this WebEx recording with you. =


IDR Interim 2/9 - BGP Yang Modules-20150209 1500-1 =
Monday, February 9, 2015
11:17 am | Eastern Standard Time (New = York, GMT-05:00)


PLAY RECORDING (1 hr 8 min)
https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/ldr.php?RCID=3Ddad5cf872d44= 69f95ad00b0330f8e9d8

This is the recording of the discussion of the BGP Yang = modules.=C2=A0

draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00

draft-shaikh-idr-bgp-model-00

 

Sue Hares

------=_NextPart_000_074D_01D04623.F057F400-- From nobody Wed Feb 11 19:54:51 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 450AC1A8A79 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 19:54:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.211 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.211 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cROF0eTCFPOv for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 19:54:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4A0991A6F38 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 19:54:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml403-hub.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id BPE62610; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 03:54:45 +0000 (GMT) Received: from NKGEML402-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.33) by lhreml403-hub.china.huawei.com (10.201.5.217) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.158.1; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 03:54:44 +0000 Received: from NKGEML501-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.2.146]) by nkgeml402-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.33]) with mapi id 14.03.0158.001; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 11:54:38 +0800 From: Qin Wu To: Dean Bogdanovic , "t.petch" Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? Thread-Index: AQHQQTHMPlQaeKL2N06OQXAz1Xeiu5zhdZqAgAn7gOD//4FdAIABeY4w Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 03:54:37 +0000 Message-ID: References: <54D34B47.1050507@pi.nu> <01d201d045f8$82b5c1a0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> <609F074B-1B65-4E04-8696-BCF50CBCAC96@juniper.net> In-Reply-To: <609F074B-1B65-4E04-8696-BCF50CBCAC96@juniper.net> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.138.41.180] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Cc: "Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , "Thomas D. Nadeau" , Loa Andersson Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] naive question ?? X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 03:54:50 -0000 >=20 > I think that the problem with MIB Modules was and is a lack of=20 > knowledge of management in general and of SNMP in particular, within=20 > any working group (e.g. IDR) and that is likely to be true with YANG=20 > but at least a WG should be familiar with the technology and have a=20 > sense of which elements to include in a data or information model,=20 > even if the WG lacks the skills to turn it into YANG. >=20 > SNMP does have conformance which made it possible to create the one=20 > MIB Module with basic, intermediate and advanced subsets. YANG lacks=20 > that but has if-feature which I see as complicated, easy to get wrong=20 > both in terms of getting the statement correct with respect to the=20 > logic that has been agreed, and in choosing when to use it or not. (A=20 > bit like novice programmers who learn that when two or three=20 > statements appear more than once, they can be replaced by a procedure=20 > or function, making the code shorter and harder to understand and=20 > maintain). I suspect that if-feature is much over-used and that the=20 > cost of that will become apparent in a few years time. One of YANG strong sides is the extensibility and augmentation. If-feature = is very useful, but it should be carefully used. A much better way to desig= n YANG models is using following base model standard extension model proprietary extension model With base model, a basic set of features is described. That model can be th= en imported into another model, like standard or proprietary extension mode= l, and augmented with more features. This provides easier to read and maint= enance of the code. Take a look at draft-ietf-netmod-acl-model for example. Dean [Qin]: Good point. From nobody Thu Feb 12 10:30:18 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 882811A007D for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 10:30:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uV6jJFSl-yxA for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 10:30:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from asmtp3.iomartmail.com (asmtp3.iomartmail.com [62.128.201.159]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DC25B1A07BD for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 10:30:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from asmtp3.iomartmail.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by asmtp3.iomartmail.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t1CIU1NR031690; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 18:30:01 GMT Received: from 950129200 (xdsl-77-74-119-17.c.btirol.at [77.74.119.17] (may be forged)) (authenticated bits=0) by asmtp3.iomartmail.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id t1CITxit031618 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 12 Feb 2015 18:29:59 GMT From: "Adrian Farrel" To: References: In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 18:29:58 -0000 Message-ID: <023c01d046f1$e8bfc910$ba3f5b30$@olddog.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_023D_01D046F1.E8C2AF40" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQJzcvWb9XreKXEvLbgRzeJkMtlc6wGKFagum5qtA+A= Content-Language: en-gb X-TM-AS-MML: disable X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.1.0.1576-7.5.0.1018-21326.002 X-TM-AS-Result: No--20.293-10.0-31-10 X-imss-scan-details: No--20.293-10.0-31-10 X-TMASE-MatchedRID: osbPkXL7cbs2i9bUejmzJPDrFod3YoIKGbJMFqqIm9wJ/KT4ih4XXD5Q FsH1QNsOiZ7wV9rLsuiRKwToAkL99kKpkA/7jeKVvHKClHGjjr3WSrKtwxqWpTIwGbz71MhSdhe NPERaTABVROfDQVBuh81umWBnViNms1RWeqLGIw61PiMh4ZF39UFCimNMDqJK4aeigiNG/3BReD 6gNYbukjgzRRkK97aDX0rc2h4qpXIDh1tb/sWFHK91/YHX0i1lOFrEjYh/1F4zFWOYrWw6AyYnR DSEEHlq2Bz1RK2ct/1rtgfnBAuSM+2u5u3xOQvhwbRQ2Bpmlipu/Xr6CKXiN9KWShEsIp8TnpBW eVcwjKBet9iiyf76iqEgGCR+ger2Ih2a2QHA7cOXA4Z4r9atc1PgO2JKQydYKAzGd8VeOIh1cNs cXGbYX52/tGtKiEAkKSbyS6Wz3z9oSgcD5h7Dxbu9iqQJLR0vtiJ1egGj+pWVIU9/CM32keygQW dkAVMsT4nzcaax9nLrpa671LAoP63tbPrvbKq+WCjDJRYeAZ0BL/XzNFFmHxS11FlOYRohT3bHV zoTp+QXlh2Nyyp8x7Rd0WwZSVdNNJyAyqAmcb92Gmf10eZIVnG1ZiUO5FClS8CF3gNU2V1qRyrZ EAcpymPqdi9REDednuOhtEsGi0ZP5mzaUz6wQBD3+0w1DhqK3kR1SkDo278ML9Wb3Qh/ha0QmL2 wrxWPWU8XtC6NtyQqhZrv4f7cOwSyWboXENunL4+sB3yBscmdNwtHz5PMSpOgRuXoZQ0z2LJBAP QFsVq7sLiGJ4XBUoAy6p60ZV621ROx5lZ1Rh7+xOhjarOnHkw1w1aNU3z4IpL3UuT3JiiDlAzml SEV0mh83DSrYTJxvSypWrBtR+QoQdzesNAw1S3g7yjHe+1a Archived-At: Cc: 'Qin Wu' , david.sinicrope@ericsson.com Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] FW: WG Last Call for draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 and draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 WAS:RE: Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts available X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: adrian@olddog.co.uk List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 18:30:12 -0000 This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_023D_01D046F1.E8C2AF40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit FYI From: Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich) [mailto:mehmet.ersue@nsn.com] Sent: 12 February 2015 15:37 To: Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich); netconf@ietf.org Cc: ops-ads@tools.ietf.org; rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org; int-ads@tools.ietf.org; app-ads@tools.ietf.org; core@ietf.org; 6tisch@ietf.org; 6lo@ietf.org; i2rs@ietf.org Subject: RE: WG Last Call for draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 and draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 WAS:RE: Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts available Dear All, this is a friendly reminder on the WGLC of the Restconf and YANG-Patch drafts. As RESTCONF is a major protocol we expect a detailed and thorough review within NETCONF WG but also by the related WGs before publishing. Please review and send your comments to the NETCONF WG mailing list by February 26, 2015 EOB PT. Many Thanks! Cheers, Mehmet From: Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich) Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2015 2:23 PM To: netconf@ietf.org Cc: ops-ads@tools.ietf.org; rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org; 'int-ads@tools.ietf.org'; 'app-ads@tools.ietf.org'; 'core@ietf.org'; 6tisch@ietf.org; '6lo@ietf.org'; 'i2rs@ietf.org' Subject: WG Last Call for draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 and draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 WAS:RE: Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts available Dear NETCONF WG, we hereby issue a WG Last Call for 3 weeks for the drafts below: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 Please review and send your comments to the NETCONF WG mailing list by February 26, 2015 EOB PT. The related draft-ietf-netconf-yang-library will follow with LC as soon as the remaining two issues are solved (see http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-library). RESTCONF documents are planned to publish as standard track documents. As RESTCONF is a major protocol we expect a detailed and thorough review within NETCONF WG but also by the related WGs before publishing. Therefore the WGLC is planned for 3 weeks and APP, INT and RTG area ADs will be informed as well as Core, I2rs, 6lo, and 6tisch WGs are invited to review. Please state explicitly that you have read/reviewed and whether you support the publication. Please indicate also if you plan to implement or have already implementation experience with RESTCONF. Thank you, Mehmet and Mahesh From: Netconf [mailto:netconf-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of ext Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich) Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2015 4:05 PM To: netconf@ietf.org Subject: [Netconf] Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts available All, 1 YANG patch and 9 Restconf issues have been solved and provided in the drafts below. These issues have been set to the status Review (https://github.com/netconf-wg/restconf/issues). Please check and comment on the drafts below before we go to WGLC soon: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 Regards, Mehmet ------=_NextPart_000_023D_01D046F1.E8C2AF40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

FYI

 

From: Ersue, Mehmet = (NSN - DE/Munich) [mailto:mehmet.ersue@nsn.com]
Sent: 12 = February 2015 15:37
To: Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich); = netconf@ietf.org
Cc: ops-ads@tools.ietf.org; = rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org; int-ads@tools.ietf.org; app-ads@tools.ietf.org; = core@ietf.org; 6tisch@ietf.org; 6lo@ietf.org; = i2rs@ietf.org
Subject: RE: WG Last Call for = draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 and draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 = WAS:RE: Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts = available

 

Dear = All,

 

this is a friendly = reminder on the WGLC of the Restconf and YANG-Patch = drafts.

 

As RESTCONF is a = major protocol we expect a detailed and thorough review within NETCONF = WG but also by the related WGs before = publishing.

 

Please review and = send your comments to the NETCONF WG mailing list by February 26, 2015 = EOB PT.

 

Many = Thanks!

 

Cheers, =
Mehmet

 

From: Ersue, Mehmet = (NSN - DE/Munich)
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2015 2:23 = PM
To: netconf@ietf.org
Cc: ops-ads@tools.ietf.org; = rtg-ads@tools.ietf.org; 'int-ads@tools.ietf.org'; = 'app-ads@tools.ietf.org'; 'core@ietf.org'; 6tisch@ietf.org; = '6lo@ietf.org'; 'i2rs@ietf.org'
Subject: WG Last Call for = draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 and draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 = WAS:RE: Restconf-04 and YANG-Patch-03 drafts = available

 

Dear NETCONF = WG,

 

we hereby issue a = WG Last Call for 3 weeks for the drafts below:

 

https://too= ls.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-restconf-04 =

https://too= ls.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-patch-03 =

 

Please review and = send your comments to the NETCONF WG mailing list by February 26, 2015 = EOB PT.

The related = draft-ietf-netconf-yang-library will follow with LC as soon as the = remaining two issues are solved

(see http:= //tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-netconf-yang-library).

 

RESTCONF documents = are planned to publish as standard track = documents.

As RESTCONF is a = major protocol we expect a detailed and thorough review within NETCONF = WG but also by the related WGs before = publishing.

Therefore the WGLC = is planned for 3 weeks and APP, INT and RTG area ADs will be informed as = well as Core, I2rs, 6lo, and 6tisch WGs are invited to = review.

 

Please state = explicitly that you have read/reviewed and whether you support the = publication.

Please indicate = also if you plan to implement or have already implementation experience = with RESTCONF.

 

Thank = you,

Mehmet and = Mahesh

 

 

All,

 

1 YANG patch and = 9 Restconf issues have been solved and provided in the drafts below. =

These issues have = been set to the status Review (https://github.com= /netconf-wg/restconf/issues).

 

Please check and = comment on the drafts below before we go to WGLC = soon:

 

Regards,
Mehmet =

 

 

<= /body> ------=_NextPart_000_023D_01D046F1.E8C2AF40-- From nobody Thu Feb 12 14:08:54 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D59E1A1A0B for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 14:08:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -13.911 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-13.911 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zmas7dt1oEUN for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 14:08:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from rcdn-iport-2.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-2.cisco.com [173.37.86.73]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 351531A0AF7 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 14:08:44 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=820; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1423778924; x=1424988524; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:content-id: content-transfer-encoding:mime-version; bh=7K61GgZJ+Khi4jmA0lGj9o8/ZrjUWLd8OgZMe7MZIwc=; b=gTvEOyO9h3Gtf1q45JB59I2BJr4oD2e7+kZA4/3nL0h4tUAJJuesnVNc 0W4oQyJiv3FZVEXP1SgZQqCYyqe12AswhVgzus5ndd+kKWAlfZI9uI3sL nUz5NSnRrkR9slqiEpNadF/C1NRHkRE/TzoTlCCqWeeJB6XS+7zY78RUI Q=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AiAFAHsj3VStJA2K/2dsb2JhbABbgwaBMMkLAQmBMUMBAQEBAQF8hBN5EgGBACcEDogy1UoBAQEBAQEBAwEBAQEBHY95hDEFigKFJ4kzgRiOKoM+IoNugjN/AQEB X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,567,1418083200"; d="scan'208";a="396055379" Received: from alln-core-5.cisco.com ([173.36.13.138]) by rcdn-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 12 Feb 2015 22:08:43 +0000 Received: from xhc-rcd-x05.cisco.com (xhc-rcd-x05.cisco.com [173.37.183.79]) by alln-core-5.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t1CM8h4T031906 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Thu, 12 Feb 2015 22:08:43 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.175]) by xhc-rcd-x05.cisco.com ([173.37.183.79]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 16:08:43 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Thomas Morin Thread-Topic: rtg-cfg draft Thread-Index: AQHQRxB2S+QjqnB8uUmcVO7eDFx1tA== Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 22:08:43 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-ID: <75822E68F2E26D4BB2769ABCD81616A6@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: Routing YANG , Ladislav Lhotka Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg draft X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 22:08:50 -0000 Hi Thomas,=20 It is my understanding that the RIBs were moved out of the routing-instance in response to your comment that a RIB would need to be attached to multiple routing instances. I don=B9t agree with this model. I believe that a routing instance implies a VRF, virtual router or something in between and that a RIB should be associated with one and only one routing instance. Additionally, I feel that RIBs are basically passive entities with respect to import/export of routes between RIBs in the same or other routing-instances. Rather, all import/export is under the control of a routing-protocol. For example, this would be handled by a BGP routing-protocol instance for L3VPNs. I=B9d like to get the opinions of others on this fundamental aspect of the rtg-cfg model.=20 Thanks, Acee=20 From nobody Thu Feb 12 15:03:15 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95EA01A00EA for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 15:03:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -13.911 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-13.911 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LLmfXEeDzc_Z for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 15:03:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from alln-iport-7.cisco.com (alln-iport-7.cisco.com [173.37.142.94]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B66FA1A008F for ; 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Thu, 12 Feb 2015 17:09:42 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Juergen Schoenwaelder , Xufeng Liu Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances Thread-Index: AQHQRxj77tD6GUYxhkmEAnTuReZw3g== Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 23:09:42 +0000 Message-ID: References: <35023717-7EE8-4F45-B2F4-B24E0F86FA5A@nic.cz> <20150113212732.GD1545@elstar.local> <23976026-499F-4C9C-844A-DB53BE244992@nic.cz> <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> In-Reply-To: <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-ID: <46F9CFCEA069744DADDD76A62BE62B93@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Routing WG , Andy Bierman , Jeff Tantsura , Ladislav Lhotka Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 23:09:48 -0000 I believe the fact that we are having trouble resolving this is that the model is wrong. I would propose the following: 1. Remove the interface list completely from rtf-cfg configuration. 2. Augment the RFC 7223 to include a reference to a routing-instance. An interface should be part of one and only one routing-instance. 3. Provide a list of interfaces in the operational state in the rtg-cfg model.=20 One reason I'm proposing this change is that I believe a routing-instance implies an IPv4/IPv6 address space and the interfaces list MUST NOT be disjoint from the assigned addresses (refer to RFC 7277). If you want to have a list of interfaces in the routing-instance, you should deprecate RFC 7277 or, at least, say that it only applies to the default instance. In all fairness, Lada disagrees with me on this point and wants the flexibility of associating an interface with multiple routing-instances. Additionally, he feels that the list inside the routing-instance will facilitate better interface selection checking. I don=B9t see the latter as an issue as the same checking could be applied when an attempt is made to augment the RFC 7223 interface. Thanks, Acee=20 =20 On 1/14/15, 12:46 PM, "Juergen Schoenwaelder" wrote: >On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 04:43:29PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote: >> Hi Andy, >>=20 >> The concatenated string format is actually what we plan to do. However, >>to me, it is more like a hack than an engineered solution. The model >>fails to capture such a relationship properly. >> > >If your interface names are no unique, I would assume that you will >face other issues as well. For example, one may use an interface name >to disambiguate link-local addresses. I am not sure how that works if >your interface name is not unique. > >/js > >--=20 >Juergen Schoenwaelder Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH >Phone: +49 421 200 3587 Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany >Fax: +49 421 200 3103 From nobody Thu Feb 12 17:21:00 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB80A1A6F22; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 15:18:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.601 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.601 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yZV_zBqip5DC; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 15:18:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from usevmg20.ericsson.net (usevmg20.ericsson.net [198.24.6.45]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3D4471A1DBE; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 15:18:02 -0800 (PST) X-AuditID: c618062d-f79376d000000ceb-79-54dce0f7fe13 Received: from EUSAAHC008.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [147.117.188.96]) by usevmg20.ericsson.net (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 2D.68.03307.7F0ECD45; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 18:20:56 +0100 (CET) Received: from EUSAAMB103.ericsson.se ([147.117.188.120]) by EUSAAHC008.ericsson.se ([147.117.188.96]) with mapi id 14.03.0210.002; Thu, 12 Feb 2015 18:18:00 -0500 From: Antoni Przygienda To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Routing YANG , Routing WG , Thomas Morin , Ladislav Lhotka Thread-Topic: rtg-cfg draft hierarchy (Reply to this one) Thread-Index: AQHQRxh1ZqTFjLUtMEu1r3b/ugmA/5ztozGw Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 23:18:00 +0000 Message-ID: <2E4BB27CAB87BF43B4207C0E55860F1824B724@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.117.188.10] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFnrDLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyuXRPgu6PB3dCDP5NELKY/HYes8WFVXPZ LH4/vw1kvfnNbLF5+VoWB1aPKb83snosWfKTyWPT5TuMHj+OhQWwRHHZpKTmZJalFunbJXBl XD14jrXglkDF3sOt7A2MR3i7GDk5JARMJDbfXMoEYYtJXLi3ng3EFhI4wiixbG58FyMXkL2c UeLbrGfMIAk2AQuJy9+eMoMkRAQOM0pMv7WYBSQhLGAp0baykxXEFhGwktg68ymQzQFkG0k8 3WgIEmYRUJV4svw1O4jNK+AtcWtWNzPEMi2JS8engsU5BbQlbuzbAhZnBDro+6k1YMcxC4hL 3HoyH+pQAYkle84zQ9iiEi8f/2OFsJUkJi09xwpRrydxY+oUNghbW2LZwtfMEHsFJU7OfMIy gVF0FpKxs5C0zELSMgtJywJGllWMHKXFqWW56UYGmxiB0XNMgk13B+Oel5aHGAU4GJV4eA3E 74QIsSaWFVfmHmKU5mBREudd9OBgiJBAemJJanZqakFqUXxRaU5q8SFGJg5OqQbG4L9hB7Pq +Lruxk3WlZ3Gvenylqsbu2IKYwKqe1XkrI5eFz5y+PYRofTeuZ9fvLmzT/yoROXJNex32ozO 6q/5UJQ022Gl7hxd9g8Lr/rvkDbi91/3f4e553KJojnxEuyn2D+dPN/8iINpf9r5npK7PVOL t/M5uP/WelDDLq5wbI/KvJZArbnLlFiKMxINtZiLihMBKXBtzX8CAAA= Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 17:20:56 -0800 Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg draft hierarchy (Reply to this one) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2015 23:18:29 -0000 In short, I agree with Mr. Lindem (unsurprisingly). An "n to 1" model between (same) routing protocol instances and RIB presen= ts many unresolvable problems as soon address spaces overlap. Basically rou= te from instance 1 becomes undistinguishable from route from instance 2 wit= h same address (RDs are not intended to be in RIB, they are local concepts = within a protocol). One could image different ADs _per_ instance of same p= rotocol but I'd like to see the use case for that.=20 Same for interfaces, an interface has an address (generally, let's not disc= uss link locals and unnumbered and such) and the address is in an address s= pace. RIB is basically a closure of an 'routable' address space and its sum= maries (prefixes) over multiple protocols dealing with reachability computa= tion. --- tony=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: rtgwg [mailto:rtgwg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Acee Lindem (ace= e) > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2015 3:06 PM > To: Routing YANG; Routing WG; Thomas Morin; Ladislav Lhotka > Subject: rtg-cfg draft hierarchy (Reply to this one) >=20 > Hi Thomas, >=20 > It is my understanding that the RIBs were moved out of the routing-instan= ce in > response to your comment that a RIB would need to be attached to multiple > routing instances. I don=B9t agree with this model. I believe that a rout= ing instance > implies a VRF, virtual router or something in between and that a RIB shou= ld be > associated with one and only one routing instance. Additionally, I feel t= hat RIBs > are basically passive entities with respect to import/export of routes be= tween > RIBs in the same or other routing-instances. Rather, all import/export is= under > the control of a routing-protocol. For example, this would be handled by = a BGP > routing-protocol instance for L3VPNs. >=20 > I=B9d like to get the opinions of others on this fundamental aspect of th= e rtg-cfg > model. >=20 > Thanks, > Acee >=20 > _______________________________________________ > rtgwg mailing list > rtgwg@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtgwg From nobody Fri Feb 13 02:10:38 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD2B11A6F3C for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 02:10:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wH66DsVCOC92 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 02:10:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from trail.lhotka.name (trail.lhotka.name [77.48.224.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FAAD1A6F2E for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 02:10:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [195.113.220.110]) by trail.lhotka.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id BA1081CC05B5; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 11:10:29 +0100 (CET) From: Ladislav Lhotka To: "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Thomas Morin , Routing YANG , "rtg-wg\@ietf.org" In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Notmuch/0.19 (http://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/24.4.51.2 (x86_64-apple-darwin14.0.0) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 11:10:29 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (added rtg-wg) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 10:10:36 -0000 Hi, "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: > Hi Thomas,=20 > > It is my understanding that the RIBs were moved out of the > routing-instance in response to your comment that a RIB would need to be > attached to multiple routing instances. I don=C2=B9t agree with this > model. I Acee refers to this comment that Thomas made in his review of draft-ietf-netmod-routing-cfg-02 on 2012-03-23: "Allowing multiple "routers" is a good starting point for using these specs in the context of RFC4364 (MPLS/BGP IP VPNs). However, if I understand correctly Yang syntax, the way the filters are defined would not work in the context of RFC4364, where a BGP routing instance in the master "router" exports selected routes in each of the routing table of each VPN (VRF). The VRF also export routes to the master instance." And indeed, in rev. -03 the list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") was the moved out of the routing instance (then called "router") and became global. Lada > believe that a routing instance implies a VRF, virtual router or something > in between and that a RIB should be associated with one and only one > routing instance. Additionally, I feel that RIBs are basically passive > entities with respect to import/export of routes between RIBs in the same > or other routing-instances. Rather, all import/export is under the control > of a routing-protocol. For example, this would be handled by a BGP > routing-protocol instance for L3VPNs. > > I=C2=B9d like to get the opinions of others on this fundamental aspect of= the > rtg-cfg model.=20 > > Thanks, > Acee=20 > > --=20 Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Fri Feb 13 02:26:03 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 373931A6F24; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 02:26:02 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JAvQaLG6_WY5; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 02:25:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from trail.lhotka.name (trail.lhotka.name [77.48.224.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EF671A6F22; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 02:25:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [195.113.220.110]) by trail.lhotka.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3515B1CC05B5; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 11:25:56 +0100 (CET) From: Ladislav Lhotka To: "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Xufeng Liu In-Reply-To: References: <35023717-7EE8-4F45-B2F4-B24E0F86FA5A@nic.cz> <20150113212732.GD1545@elstar.local> <23976026-499F-4C9C-844A-DB53BE244992@nic.cz> <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> User-Agent: Notmuch/0.19 (http://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/24.4.51.2 (x86_64-apple-darwin14.0.0) Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 11:25:58 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Andy Bierman , Jeff Tantsura , Routing WG Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 10:26:02 -0000 "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: > I believe the fact that we are having trouble resolving this is that the > model is wrong. I would propose the following: I don't agree the model is wrong. In fact, I belive in Junos CLI it is done exactly the same way, e.g. set interface fe-0/0/2 unit 0 family inet address 6.6.6.5/24 set routing-instances blue-vr interface fe-0/0/2.0 (IP address is configured in the interface subtree, and an interface is assigned to a VRF in the routing-instance subtree). I believe the troubles we are having are due to the different logic in the CLIs of the two major routing platforms. Lada > > 1. Remove the interface list completely from rtf-cfg configuration. > 2. Augment the RFC 7223 to include a reference to a routing-instance. > An interface should be part of one and only one routing-instance. > 3. Provide a list of interfaces in the operational state in the rtg-cfg > model.=20 > > One reason I'm proposing this change is that I believe a routing-instance > implies an IPv4/IPv6 address space and the interfaces list MUST NOT be > disjoint from the assigned addresses (refer to RFC 7277). If you want to > have a list of interfaces in the routing-instance, you should deprecate > RFC 7277 or, at least, say that it only applies to the default instance. > > In all fairness, Lada disagrees with me on this point and wants the > flexibility of associating an interface with multiple routing-instances. > Additionally, he feels that the list inside the routing-instance will > facilitate better interface selection checking. I don=C2=B9t see the latt= er as > an issue as the same checking could be applied when an attempt is made to > augment the RFC 7223 interface. > > Thanks, > Acee=20 > >=20=20=20=20 > > On 1/14/15, 12:46 PM, "Juergen Schoenwaelder" > wrote: > >>On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 04:43:29PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote: >>> Hi Andy, >>>=20 >>> The concatenated string format is actually what we plan to do. However, >>>to me, it is more like a hack than an engineered solution. The model >>>fails to capture such a relationship properly. >>> >> >>If your interface names are no unique, I would assume that you will >>face other issues as well. For example, one may use an interface name >>to disambiguate link-local addresses. I am not sure how that works if >>your interface name is not unique. >> >>/js >> >>--=20 >>Juergen Schoenwaelder Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH >>Phone: +49 421 200 3587 Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany >>Fax: +49 421 200 3103 > --=20 Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Fri Feb 13 09:45:48 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 702001A001B; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 09:45:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NEN4UxZ7FnLU; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 09:45:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from alln-iport-3.cisco.com (alln-iport-3.cisco.com [173.37.142.90]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 91EAE1A0018; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 09:45:34 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=4710; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1423849536; x=1425059136; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:content-id:content-transfer-encoding: mime-version; bh=tqKO0oqnhi3KGjpQ0GoQS6jF5JlKsR2avfYIm38NB/w=; b=hqVjGX4x6d4pbUYhxkQKIbFO7n90cPQuhS/7yHrfme+tH+0RqawVPf/c +xLOOFE9vf4Q7FOlE/X3yuZpaKJRnnLd7U+bwuOlqdtXT9uu8XDvjOhVw sWELCjzunbtA1XH1bqhjh9fEqFA2cxMeFMETmk5PeEzCGRCdPZ8QZSh77 Y=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0AtBQCON95U/5NdJa1YA4MGUloEgn6/KIV1Ahx4QwEBAQEBAXyEDQEBBDQ+Bw4CAgEIEAgEKAICGRclAgQBDQUbiBKhS5xkBpciAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBFwSBF4lxhDoYCxAHEYJRgUgFjzSJNYEYji+DPiKDbm+BRH8BAQE X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,572,1418083200"; d="scan'208";a="123368306" Received: from rcdn-core-11.cisco.com ([173.37.93.147]) by alln-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP; 13 Feb 2015 17:45:35 +0000 Received: from xhc-aln-x01.cisco.com (xhc-aln-x01.cisco.com [173.36.12.75]) by rcdn-core-11.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t1DHjXLD021284 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Fri, 13 Feb 2015 17:45:33 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.175]) by xhc-aln-x01.cisco.com ([173.36.12.75]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 11:45:33 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Ladislav Lhotka , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Xufeng Liu Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances Thread-Index: AQHQRxj77tD6GUYxhkmEAnTuReZw3pzuxUwAgAAm/wA= Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 17:45:33 +0000 Message-ID: References: <35023717-7EE8-4F45-B2F4-B24E0F86FA5A@nic.cz> <20150113212732.GD1545@elstar.local> <23976026-499F-4C9C-844A-DB53BE244992@nic.cz> <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="euc-kr" Content-ID: <75C74B08A8E30A46AF60F338B03F1736@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Andy Bierman , Jeff Tantsura , Routing WG Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 17:45:38 -0000 DQoNCk9uIDIvMTMvMTUsIDU6MjUgQU0sICJMYWRpc2xhdiBMaG90a2EiIDxsaG90a2FAbmljLmN6 PiB3cm90ZToNCg0KPiJBY2VlIExpbmRlbSAoYWNlZSkiIDxhY2VlQGNpc2NvLmNvbT4gd3JpdGVz Og0KPg0KPj4gSSBiZWxpZXZlIHRoZSBmYWN0IHRoYXQgd2UgYXJlIGhhdmluZyB0cm91YmxlIHJl c29sdmluZyB0aGlzIGlzIHRoYXQgdGhlDQo+PiBtb2RlbCBpcyB3cm9uZy4gSSB3b3VsZCBwcm9w b3NlIHRoZSBmb2xsb3dpbmc6DQo+DQo+SSBkb24ndCBhZ3JlZSB0aGUgbW9kZWwgaXMgd3Jvbmcu IEluIGZhY3QsIEkgYmVsaXZlIGluIEp1bm9zIENMSSBpdCBpcw0KPmRvbmUgZXhhY3RseSB0aGUg c2FtZSB3YXksIGUuZy4NCj4NCj4gIHNldCBpbnRlcmZhY2UgZmUtMC8wLzIgdW5pdCAwIGZhbWls eSBpbmV0IGFkZHJlc3MgNi42LjYuNS8yNA0KPg0KPiAgc2V0IHJvdXRpbmctaW5zdGFuY2VzIGJs dWUtdnIgaW50ZXJmYWNlIGZlLTAvMC8yLjANCj4NCj4oSVAgYWRkcmVzcyBpcyBjb25maWd1cmVk IGluIHRoZSBpbnRlcmZhY2Ugc3VidHJlZSwgYW5kIGFuIGludGVyZmFjZSBpcw0KPmFzc2lnbmVk IHRvIGEgVlJGIGluIHRoZSByb3V0aW5nLWluc3RhbmNlIHN1YnRyZWUpLg0KPg0KPkkgYmVsaWV2 ZSB0aGUgdHJvdWJsZXMgd2UgYXJlIGhhdmluZyBhcmUgZHVlIHRvIHRoZSBkaWZmZXJlbnQgbG9n 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IHVuaXF1ZSwgSSB3b3VsZCBhc3N1bWUgdGhhdCB5b3Ugd2lsbA0KPj4+ZmFjZSBvdGhlciBpc3N1 ZXMgYXMgd2VsbC4gRm9yIGV4YW1wbGUsIG9uZSBtYXkgdXNlIGFuIGludGVyZmFjZSBuYW1lDQo+ Pj50byBkaXNhbWJpZ3VhdGUgbGluay1sb2NhbCBhZGRyZXNzZXMuIEkgYW0gbm90IHN1cmUgaG93 IHRoYXQgd29ya3MgaWYNCj4+PnlvdXIgaW50ZXJmYWNlIG5hbWUgaXMgbm90IHVuaXF1ZS4NCj4+ Pg0KPj4+L2pzDQo+Pj4NCj4+Pi0tIA0KPj4+SnVlcmdlbiBTY2hvZW53YWVsZGVyICAgICAgICAg ICBKYWNvYnMgVW5pdmVyc2l0eSBCcmVtZW4gZ0dtYkgNCj4+PlBob25lOiArNDkgNDIxIDIwMCAz NTg3ICAgICAgICAgQ2FtcHVzIFJpbmcgMSwgMjg3NTkgQnJlbWVuLCBHZXJtYW55DQo+Pj5GYXg6 ICAgKzQ5IDQyMSAyMDAgMzEwMyAgICAgICAgIDxodHRwOi8vd3d3LmphY29icy11bml2ZXJzaXR5 LmRlLz4NCj4+DQo+DQo+LS0gDQo+TGFkaXNsYXYgTGhvdGthLCBDWi5OSUMgTGFicw0KPlBHUCBL ZXkgSUQ6IEU3NEU4QzBDDQoNCg== From nobody Fri Feb 13 10:07:19 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 848801A0161; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 10:07:16 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xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.175]) by xhc-aln-x13.cisco.com ([173.36.12.87]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Fri, 13 Feb 2015 12:07:12 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Ladislav Lhotka , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Xufeng Liu Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances Thread-Index: AQHQRxj77tD6GUYxhkmEAnTuReZw3pzuxUwAgAAm/wCAAAYLAA== Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 18:07:11 +0000 Message-ID: References: <35023717-7EE8-4F45-B2F4-B24E0F86FA5A@nic.cz> <20150113212732.GD1545@elstar.local> <23976026-499F-4C9C-844A-DB53BE244992@nic.cz> <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="euc-kr" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Andy Bierman , Jeff Tantsura , Routing WG Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 18:07:17 -0000 SW5kZXBlbmRlbnQgb2YgdGhlIGhpZXJhcmNoeSwgSSB0aGluayBhbiBpbnRlcmZhY2Ugc2hvdWxk IGJlIGFzc29jaWF0ZWQNCndpdGggb25lIGFuZCBvbmx5IHJvdXRpbmctaW5zdGFuY2UuIEkga25v dyBvZiBubyBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbiB0aGF0DQphbGxvd3MgdGhpcyAoaW5jbHVkaW5nIHRoZSB1 c2UgY2FzZSBvZiBzZXBhcmF0ZSBpbnN0YW5jZXMgZm9yIElQdjQgYW5kDQpJUHY2KS4gDQoNClRo YW5rcywNCkFjZWUgDQoNCk9uIDIvMTMvMTUsIDEyOjQ1IFBNLCAiQWNlZSBMaW5kZW0gKGFjZWUp IiA8YWNlZUBjaXNjby5jb20+IHdyb3RlOg0KDQo+DQo+DQo+T24gMi8xMy8xNSwgNToyNSBBTSwg IkxhZGlzbGF2IExob3RrYSIgPGxob3RrYUBuaWMuY3o+IHdyb3RlOg0KPg0KPj4iQWNlZSBMaW5k ZW0gKGFjZWUpIiA8YWNlZUBjaXNjby5jb20+IHdyaXRlczoNCj4+DQo+Pj4gSSBiZWxpZXZlIHRo 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(PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [172.29.2.202]) by trail.lhotka.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 75D031CC0475; Sat, 14 Feb 2015 11:46:18 +0100 (CET) From: Ladislav Lhotka To: "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Xufeng Liu In-Reply-To: References: <35023717-7EE8-4F45-B2F4-B24E0F86FA5A@nic.cz> <20150113212732.GD1545@elstar.local> <23976026-499F-4C9C-844A-DB53BE244992@nic.cz> <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> User-Agent: Notmuch/0.19 (http://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/24.4.51.2 (x86_64-apple-darwin14.0.0) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 11:46:17 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Andy Bierman , Jeff Tantsura Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 10:46:23 -0000 "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: > On 2/13/15, 5:25 AM, "Ladislav Lhotka" wrote: > >>"Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: >> >>> I believe the fact that we are having trouble resolving this is that the >>> model is wrong. I would propose the following: >> >>I don't agree the model is wrong. In fact, I belive in Junos CLI it is >>done exactly the same way, e.g. >> >> set interface fe-0/0/2 unit 0 family inet address 6.6.6.5/24 >> >> set routing-instances blue-vr interface fe-0/0/2.0 >> >>(IP address is configured in the interface subtree, and an interface is >>assigned to a VRF in the routing-instance subtree). >> >>I believe the troubles we are having are due to the different logic in >>the CLIs of the two major routing platforms. > > Does it show up as a separate list in the JUNOS gated-like > configuration hierarchy? If they do configure the IPv4/IPv6 addresses Yes, here is an example: https://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/junos14.2/topics/example/routin= g-instance-interface-settings-configuring-junos-nm.html Lada > disjoint from the routing -instance instances imply the corresponding > IPv4/IPv6 address space and the RIBs, I still don=E2=80=99t like the > inconsistency. > > The previous product I worked on, IPOS, had the interfaces in > routing-instance but the routing-instance interface included all the layer > 3 definition including the IP/IPv6 addresses (i.e., the RFC 7277 > definitions).=20 > > Thanks, > Acee=20 > > > > > > >> >>Lada >> >>> >>> 1. Remove the interface list completely from rtf-cfg configuration. >>> 2. Augment the RFC 7223 to include a reference to a routing-instance. >>> An interface should be part of one and only one routing-instance. >>> 3. Provide a list of interfaces in the operational state in the >>>rtg-cfg >>> model.=20 >>> >>> One reason I'm proposing this change is that I believe a >>>routing-instance >>> implies an IPv4/IPv6 address space and the interfaces list MUST NOT be >>> disjoint from the assigned addresses (refer to RFC 7277). If you want to >>> have a list of interfaces in the routing-instance, you should deprecate >>> RFC 7277 or, at least, say that it only applies to the default instance. >>> >>> In all fairness, Lada disagrees with me on this point and wants the >>> flexibility of associating an interface with multiple routing-instances. >>> Additionally, he feels that the list inside the routing-instance will >>> facilitate better interface selection checking. I don=C2=B9t see the la= tter >>>as >>> an issue as the same checking could be applied when an attempt is made >>>to >>> augment the RFC 7223 interface. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Acee=20 >>> >>>=20=20=20=20 >>> >>> On 1/14/15, 12:46 PM, "Juergen Schoenwaelder" >>> wrote: >>> >>>>On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 04:43:29PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote: >>>>> Hi Andy, >>>>>=20 >>>>> The concatenated string format is actually what we plan to do. >>>>>However, >>>>>to me, it is more like a hack than an engineered solution. The model >>>>>fails to capture such a relationship properly. >>>>> >>>> >>>>If your interface names are no unique, I would assume that you will >>>>face other issues as well. For example, one may use an interface name >>>>to disambiguate link-local addresses. I am not sure how that works if >>>>your interface name is not unique. >>>> >>>>/js >>>> >>>>--=20 >>>>Juergen Schoenwaelder Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH >>>>Phone: +49 421 200 3587 Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany >>>>Fax: +49 421 200 3103 >>> >> >>--=20 >>Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >>PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C > --=20 Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Sat Feb 14 03:26:25 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C6E41A1BE7 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2015 03:26:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham 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A0A8BQDtL99U/4gNJK1YA4MGUl6Cf783hW8CHHJDAQEBAQEBfIQNAQEEND4HDgICAQgQCAQoAgIZFyUCBAENBRuIEg2gJJxkBpcIAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBFwSBF4lxhDoYCxAHEYJRgUgFjzeJNYEYjjWDPiKDbm8BgUN/AQEB X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,575,1418083200"; d="scan'208";a="123508626" Received: from alln-core-3.cisco.com ([173.36.13.136]) by alln-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Feb 2015 11:26:19 +0000 Received: from xhc-rcd-x01.cisco.com (xhc-rcd-x01.cisco.com [173.37.183.75]) by alln-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t1EBQJbe030482 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sat, 14 Feb 2015 11:26:19 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.175]) by xhc-rcd-x01.cisco.com ([173.37.183.75]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Sat, 14 Feb 2015 05:26:19 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Ladislav Lhotka , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Xufeng Liu Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances Thread-Index: AQHQRxj77tD6GUYxhkmEAnTuReZw3pzuxUwAgAAm/wCAAXEDgP//t1yA Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 11:26:18 +0000 Message-ID: References: <35023717-7EE8-4F45-B2F4-B24E0F86FA5A@nic.cz> <20150113212732.GD1545@elstar.local> <23976026-499F-4C9C-844A-DB53BE244992@nic.cz> <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="euc-kr" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Andy Bierman , Jeff Tantsura Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 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X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E97D71A1BE7; Sat, 14 Feb 2015 03:49:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Hi6HcTv2iQuC; Sat, 14 Feb 2015 03:49:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from trail.lhotka.name (trail.lhotka.name [77.48.224.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD4351A1BE0; Sat, 14 Feb 2015 03:49:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [172.29.2.202]) by trail.lhotka.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8EA901CC0475; Sat, 14 Feb 2015 12:49:12 +0100 (CET) From: Ladislav Lhotka To: "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Xufeng Liu In-Reply-To: References: <35023717-7EE8-4F45-B2F4-B24E0F86FA5A@nic.cz> <20150113212732.GD1545@elstar.local> <23976026-499F-4C9C-844A-DB53BE244992@nic.cz> <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> User-Agent: Notmuch/0.19 (http://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/24.4.51.2 (x86_64-apple-darwin14.0.0) Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 12:49:11 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Andy Bierman , Jeff Tantsura , Routing WG Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 11:49:17 -0000 "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: > Independent of the hierarchy, I think an interface should be associated > with one and only routing-instance. I know of no implementation that We've been there, too. In revision -02, we had this definition ("router" later became "routing-instance"): list router { key "name"; unique "interfaces/interface/name"; ... } The role of the "unique" statement was to restrict the assignment of interfaces exactly as you write. But then we had a discussion in the NETMOD mailing list about whether such a unique statement is legal or not: http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/netmod/current/msg06386.html While I still think there is nothing wrong with that unique statement, it was eventually removed for the "ietf-routing" module. > allows this (including the use case of separate instances for IPv4 and > IPv6). This is not necessarily true. In my data model for the BIRD routing daemon (https://gitlab.labs.nic.cz/labs/yang-tools/tree/master/data-models/bird) I am using special types of routing-instances "bird-ipv4" and "bird-ipv6", and the same interface can be in both instances. This is because BIRD has to be compiled separately with support for IPv4 and IPv6, and each routing-instance then corresponds to one BIRD process. Yes, such an implementation is somewhat peculiar and needn't serve as a model. On the other hand, I don't see any reason why overlapping interface assignments should be made illegal for *all* types of routing instances. I assume the data model for routing instances of the type "VRF" will state that assignments of interfaces to routing instances have to be disjoint, and the draft explicitly states such an additional constraint is allowed (last paragraph in sec. 5.1). Isn't this sufficient? Lada > > Thanks, > Acee=20 > > On 2/13/15, 12:45 PM, "Acee Lindem (acee)" wrote: > >> >> >>On 2/13/15, 5:25 AM, "Ladislav Lhotka" wrote: >> >>>"Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: >>> >>>> I believe the fact that we are having trouble resolving this is that >>>>the >>>> model is wrong. I would propose the following: >>> >>>I don't agree the model is wrong. In fact, I belive in Junos CLI it is >>>done exactly the same way, e.g. >>> >>> set interface fe-0/0/2 unit 0 family inet address 6.6.6.5/24 >>> >>> set routing-instances blue-vr interface fe-0/0/2.0 >>> >>>(IP address is configured in the interface subtree, and an interface is >>>assigned to a VRF in the routing-instance subtree). >>> >>>I believe the troubles we are having are due to the different logic in >>>the CLIs of the two major routing platforms. >> >>Does it show up as a separate list in the JUNOS gated-like configuration >>hierarchy? If they do configure the IPv4/IPv6 addresses disjoint from the >>routing -instance instances imply the corresponding IPv4/IPv6 address >>space and the RIBs, I still don=E2=80=99t like the inconsistency. >> >>The previous product I worked on, IPOS, had the interfaces in >>routing-instance but the routing-instance interface included all the layer >>3 definition including the IP/IPv6 addresses (i.e., the RFC 7277 >>definitions).=20 >> >>Thanks, >>Acee=20 >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> >>>Lada >>> >>>> >>>> 1. Remove the interface list completely from rtf-cfg configuration. >>>> 2. Augment the RFC 7223 to include a reference to a >>>>routing-instance. >>>> An interface should be part of one and only one routing-instance. >>>> 3. Provide a list of interfaces in the operational state in the >>>>rtg-cfg >>>> model.=20 >>>> >>>> One reason I'm proposing this change is that I believe a >>>>routing-instance >>>> implies an IPv4/IPv6 address space and the interfaces list MUST NOT be >>>> disjoint from the assigned addresses (refer to RFC 7277). If you want >>>>to >>>> have a list of interfaces in the routing-instance, you should deprecate >>>> RFC 7277 or, at least, say that it only applies to the default >>>>instance. >>>> >>>> In all fairness, Lada disagrees with me on this point and wants the >>>> flexibility of associating an interface with multiple >>>>routing-instances. >>>> Additionally, he feels that the list inside the routing-instance will >>>> facilitate better interface selection checking. I don=C2=B9t see the l= atter >>>>as >>>> an issue as the same checking could be applied when an attempt is made >>>>to >>>> augment the RFC 7223 interface. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Acee=20 >>>> >>>>=20=20=20=20 >>>> >>>> On 1/14/15, 12:46 PM, "Juergen Schoenwaelder" >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>>On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 04:43:29PM +0000, Xufeng Liu wrote: >>>>>> Hi Andy, >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> The concatenated string format is actually what we plan to do. >>>>>>However, >>>>>>to me, it is more like a hack than an engineered solution. The model >>>>>>fails to capture such a relationship properly. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>If your interface names are no unique, I would assume that you will >>>>>face other issues as well. For example, one may use an interface name >>>>>to disambiguate link-local addresses. I am not sure how that works if >>>>>your interface name is not unique. >>>>> >>>>>/js >>>>> >>>>>--=20 >>>>>Juergen Schoenwaelder Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH >>>>>Phone: +49 421 200 3587 Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany >>>>>Fax: +49 421 200 3103 >>>> >>> >>>--=20 >>>Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >>>PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >>Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord > --=20 Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Wed Feb 18 03:36:16 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 543A91A87A5; Wed, 18 Feb 2015 03:36:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id D2uzpfUaK45S; Wed, 18 Feb 2015 03:36:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-we0-f175.google.com (mail-we0-f175.google.com [74.125.82.175]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 989071A802A; Wed, 18 Feb 2015 03:36:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by wesw55 with SMTP id w55so578791wes.5; Wed, 18 Feb 2015 03:36:11 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:mime-version:to :subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=IEBLgCMYZSOR/Dz8niXyx1WoKdpf4BiOaSkQ5CPn+R4=; b=G0lJpoTJ0r1LKHZoTkDbwLnToMOJ5hqsNEmNJ50S+zN9L99Y0AQTTXrcZjblCssF/B iJ1tCNjcLFShvJVEPLY7DTJwv/GMWJiksJZih/RHeFpRfrO3HJIFr489eFhKpbx+bgyw S1LLrejz1DqoYusXWvO0l52xlXA/jj1/SYwNMb33zzXB/+loW+0w5OTRJZgqGbKg5C1N dDZ4VMIvy6EYlVwrApHY7a2quV2GvEhwcvm4Kfk22ZBdMcQkAFMoJxibYlP2hYmbUacV WL2gAABUA8A/AWyv027IyxN5oIp8HqjlRyfhOcqoDBHtdtY0gNMLiWCd9NNiiBB5jxt0 7m/Q== X-Received: by 10.194.5.37 with SMTP id p5mr72422060wjp.20.1424259371395; Wed, 18 Feb 2015 03:36:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (ARennes-652-1-96-43.w2-11.abo.wanadoo.fr. [2.11.199.43]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id hs7sm25011528wib.4.2015.02.18.03.36.09 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 18 Feb 2015 03:36:10 -0800 (PST) Sender: Thomas Morin Message-ID: <54E47928.8050108@orange.com> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 12:36:08 +0100 From: Thomas Morin Organization: Orange User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Ladislav Lhotka , Routing YANG , Routing WG References: <14011_1423852286_54DE42FE_14011_2207_1_D103AD28.E652%acee@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <14011_1423852286_54DE42FE_14011_2207_1_D103AD28.E652%acee@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (PLEASE REPLY TO THIS ONE WITH THE CORRECT MAIL ALIASES) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 11:36:15 -0000 Hi Acee, Lada, It seems that my comment that you quote was more related to filters than to routing tables, and indeed, *filters* were moved from "router" to "global" in revision -03 that followed my review. Additionally, Lada, you say that based on my comments "in rev. -03 the list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") was the moved out of the routing instance (then called "router") and became global.". But if I look at -03, "routing-table" is still a child of "router". The change to make "routing-table" global was made in -05. I guess you need to find out what was the motivation for the change in -05, a few months after my initial comments were address. Best, -Thomas 2015-02-13, Acee Lindem (acee): > > Hi Lada, Thomas, > > On 2/13/15, 5:10 AM, "Ladislav Lhotka" wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: >> >>> Hi Thomas, >>> >>> It is my understanding that the RIBs were moved out of the >>> routing-instance in response to your comment that a RIB would need to be >>> attached to multiple routing instances. I don¹t agree with this >>> model. I >> >> Acee refers to this comment that Thomas made in his review of >> draft-ietf-netmod-routing-cfg-02 on 2012-03-23: >> >> "Allowing multiple "routers" is a good starting point for using these >> specs in the context of RFC4364 (MPLS/BGP IP VPNs). However, if I >> understand correctly Yang syntax, the way the filters are defined would >> not work in the context of RFC4364, where a BGP routing instance in the >> master "router" exports selected routes in each of the routing table of >> each VPN (VRF). The VRF also export routes to the master instance." >> >> And indeed, in rev. -03 the list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") >> was the moved out of the routing instance (then called "router") and >> became global. > > Then do you agree to move the RIBs back into the routing-instance? Both > the BGP YANG drafts model L3VPN definitions under the corresponding > address family in BGP. > > http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-shaikh-idr-bgp-model-00.txt > http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00.txt > > Thanks, > Acee > > > >> >> Lada >> >>> believe that a routing instance implies a VRF, virtual router or >>> something >>> in between and that a RIB should be associated with one and only one >>> routing instance. Additionally, I feel that RIBs are basically passive >>> entities with respect to import/export of routes between RIBs in the >>> same >>> or other routing-instances. Rather, all import/export is under the >>> control >>> of a routing-protocol. For example, this would be handled by a BGP >>> routing-protocol instance for L3VPNs. >>> >>> I¹d like to get the opinions of others on this fundamental aspect of the >>> rtg-cfg model. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Acee >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >> PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C > > > From nobody Wed Feb 18 12:55:29 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24DED1A1ADB; Wed, 18 Feb 2015 12:55:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -13.911 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-13.911 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost 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A0BkBQD7++RU/4wNJK1bgwZSWgSDBL9YhXECHIEDQwEBAQEBAXyEDQEBBDRVAgEIGAQoAgIwJQIEARIJiCYNnUKcZAaYQAEBAQEBBQIBH4EbiXSEHQEBHDqCYoFIBY9DiTyBGYMPhj6EboM+IoIHFxSBPG8BgQo5fwEBAQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,604,1418083200"; d="scan'208";a="397257274" Received: from alln-core-7.cisco.com ([173.36.13.140]) by rcdn-iport-6.cisco.com with ESMTP; 18 Feb 2015 20:55:23 +0000 Received: from xhc-aln-x04.cisco.com (xhc-aln-x04.cisco.com [173.36.12.78]) by alln-core-7.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t1IKtMwU023622 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Wed, 18 Feb 2015 20:55:22 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.175]) by xhc-aln-x04.cisco.com ([173.36.12.78]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Wed, 18 Feb 2015 14:55:22 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Thomas Morin , Ladislav Lhotka , Routing YANG , Routing WG Thread-Topic: rtg-cfg hierachy (PLEASE REPLY TO THIS ONE WITH THE CORRECT MAIL ALIASES) Thread-Index: AQHQS28ZM/kyJuKUo0W6/2wfbzbSMZz29E2A Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 20:55:21 +0000 Message-ID: References: <14011_1423852286_54DE42FE_14011_2207_1_D103AD28.E652%acee@cisco.com> <54E47928.8050108@orange.com> In-Reply-To: <54E47928.8050108@orange.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.197] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="euc-kr" Content-ID: <5C2546D04EF6BD4984E909402BFED729@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (PLEASE REPLY TO THIS ONE WITH THE CORRECT MAIL ALIASES) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 20:55:26 -0000 VGhhbmtzIFRob21hcyBmb3IgdGhlIGNsYXJpZmljYXRpb24uDQoNCkmhr2QgbGlrZSB0byB0aGVu 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alln-core-8.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t1IL1n71019793 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Wed, 18 Feb 2015 21:01:49 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.175]) by xhc-aln-x11.cisco.com ([173.36.12.85]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Wed, 18 Feb 2015 15:01:49 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Thomas Morin , Ladislav Lhotka , Routing YANG , Routing WG Thread-Topic: rtg-cfg hierachy (Indentation in hierarchy corrected) Thread-Index: AQHQS74c5g8pGC6LyU+IJwKVns4gSA== Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 21:01:48 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.197] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="euc-kr" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (Indentation in hierarchy corrected) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 21:01:52 -0000 VGhhbmtzIFRob21hcyBmb3IgdGhlIGNsYXJpZmljYXRpb24uDQoNCkmhr2QgbGlrZSB0byB0aGVu IHN1Z2dlc3Qgd2UgY2hhbmdlIHRoZSBydGctY2ZnIG1vZGVsIGhpZXJhcmNoeSB0byByZWZsZWN0 DQp3aGF0IG1vc3Qgcm91dGluZyBkZXZpY2UgaW1wbGVtZW50YXRpb25zLg0KVGhlcmUgaXMgYSBS SUIgKHlvdSBjYW4gY2FsbCBpdCBhIGRlZmF1bHQtUklCIGlmIHlvdSBsaWtlKSBmb3IgZXZlcnkN CkFkZHJlc3MgRmFtaWx5IChBRikuIE11bHRpcGxlIFJJQnMgcGVyIEFGIGlzIG5vdCB3aWRlbHkg aW1wbGVtZW50ZWQgYW5kIEkNCmRvbqGvdCBzZWUgaXQgYmVjb21pbmcgbW9yZSBwcmV2YWxlbnQu IEhlbmNlLCBJIGFncmVlIGl0IHNob3VsZCBiZSBhDQpmZWF0dXJlLiBUaGUgb25lIGltcGxlbWVu dGF0aW9uIEmhr20gZmFtaWxpYXIgd2l0aCBpcyBtdWx0aXBsZSB0b3BvbG9neQ0Kcm91dGluZyAo ZS5nLiwgUkZDIDQ5MTUpLCB3aGVyZSBSSUIgY29ycmVzcG9uZHMgdG8gYSBGSUIgdGhhdCBpcyBz ZWxlY3RlZA0KYmFzZWQgb24gcGFja2V0IG1hcmtpbmcuIERvZXMgYW55b25lIGhhdmUgYW55IG90 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ZXQgdGhlIG9waW5pb25zIG9mIG90aGVycyBvbiB0aGlzIGZ1bmRhbWVudGFsIGFzcGVjdCBvZg0K Pj4+PnRoZQ0KPj4+PiBydGctY2ZnIG1vZGVsLg0KPj4+Pg0KPj4+PiBUaGFua3MsDQo+Pj4+IEFj ZWUNCj4+Pj4NCj4+Pj4NCj4+Pg0KPj4+IC0tDQo+Pj4gTGFkaXNsYXYgTGhvdGthLCBDWi5OSUMg TGFicw0KPj4+IFBHUCBLZXkgSUQ6IEU3NEU4QzBDDQo+Pg0KPj4NCj4+DQo+DQoNCg0K From nobody Mon Feb 23 04:45:32 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93B151A1A88; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 04:45:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ibxv8KgXWyJ7; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 04:45:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from trail.lhotka.name (trail.lhotka.name [77.48.224.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3693B1A1A8B; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 04:45:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [195.113.220.110]) by trail.lhotka.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0F3AE1CC0249; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 13:45:32 +0100 (CET) From: Ladislav Lhotka To: Thomas Morin , "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Routing YANG , Routing WG In-Reply-To: <54E47928.8050108@orange.com> References: <14011_1423852286_54DE42FE_14011_2207_1_D103AD28.E652%acee@cisco.com> <54E47928.8050108@orange.com> User-Agent: Notmuch/0.19 (http://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/24.4.51.2 (x86_64-apple-darwin14.0.0) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 13:45:25 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (PLEASE REPLY TO THIS ONE WITH THE CORRECT MAIL ALIASES) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 12:45:29 -0000 Hi Thomas, I apologize for a late response, I was on holiday last week. Thomas Morin writes: > Hi Acee, Lada, > > It seems that my comment that you quote was more related to filters than= =20 > to routing tables, and indeed, *filters* were moved from "router" to=20 > "global" in revision -03 that followed my review. Right, but each filter could then be specified for either "connected-routing-table" or "recipient-routing-table", and if the 'remote' routing table is in a different routing instance, it IMO makes more sense to have routing tables (RIBs) as global objects accessible to all routing instances. In fact, even if RIBs are routing-instance specific, it will still be possible to access a RIB in a foreign routing instance, it will just be more laborious - one will have to specify the target routing instance & RIB. Also, names of RIBs will no more be unique system-wide. > > Additionally, Lada, you say that based on my comments "in rev. -03 the=20 > list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") was the moved out of the=20 > routing instance (then called "router") and became global.". But if I=20 > look at -03, "routing-table" is still a child of "router". The change=20 > to make "routing-table" global was made in -05. > > I guess you need to find out what was the motivation for the change in=20 > -05, a few months after my initial comments were address. Yes, you are right, it seems the immediate motivation for this change was this review by Martin Bjorklund: http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/netmod/current/msg06962.html Thanks, Lada > > Best, > > -Thomas > > > > > > 2015-02-13, Acee Lindem (acee): >> >> Hi Lada, Thomas, >> >> On 2/13/15, 5:10 AM, "Ladislav Lhotka" wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: >>> >>>> Hi Thomas, >>>> >>>> It is my understanding that the RIBs were moved out of the >>>> routing-instance in response to your comment that a RIB would need to = be >>>> attached to multiple routing instances. I don=C2=B9t agree with this >>>> model. I >>> >>> Acee refers to this comment that Thomas made in his review of >>> draft-ietf-netmod-routing-cfg-02 on 2012-03-23: >>> >>> "Allowing multiple "routers" is a good starting point for using these >>> specs in the context of RFC4364 (MPLS/BGP IP VPNs). However, if I >>> understand correctly Yang syntax, the way the filters are defined would >>> not work in the context of RFC4364, where a BGP routing instance in the >>> master "router" exports selected routes in each of the routing table of >>> each VPN (VRF). The VRF also export routes to the master instance." >>> >>> And indeed, in rev. -03 the list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") >>> was the moved out of the routing instance (then called "router") and >>> became global. >> >> Then do you agree to move the RIBs back into the routing-instance? Both >> the BGP YANG drafts model L3VPN definitions under the corresponding >> address family in BGP. >> >> http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-shaikh-idr-bgp-model-00.txt >> http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00.txt >> >> Thanks, >> Acee >> >> >> >>> >>> Lada >>> >>>> believe that a routing instance implies a VRF, virtual router or >>>> something >>>> in between and that a RIB should be associated with one and only one >>>> routing instance. Additionally, I feel that RIBs are basically passive >>>> entities with respect to import/export of routes between RIBs in the >>>> same >>>> or other routing-instances. Rather, all import/export is under the >>>> control >>>> of a routing-protocol. For example, this would be handled by a BGP >>>> routing-protocol instance for L3VPNs. >>>> >>>> I=C2=B9d like to get the opinions of others on this fundamental aspect= of the >>>> rtg-cfg model. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> Acee >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >>> PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C >> >> >> > --=20 Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Mon Feb 23 05:05:22 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3A271A1A9F; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 05:05:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NCPGnZnzTJYt; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 05:05:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from trail.lhotka.name (trail.lhotka.name [77.48.224.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 172111A1A9E; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 05:05:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [195.113.220.110]) by trail.lhotka.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 38C871CC0249; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 14:05:22 +0100 (CET) From: Ladislav Lhotka To: "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Thomas Morin , Routing YANG , Routing WG In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Notmuch/0.19 (http://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/24.4.51.2 (x86_64-apple-darwin14.0.0) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 14:05:15 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (Indentation in hierarchy corrected) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 13:05:18 -0000 "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: > Thanks Thomas for the clarification. > > I=E2=80=99d like to then suggest we change the rtg-cfg model hierarchy to= reflect > what most routing device implementations. > There is a RIB (you can call it a default-RIB if you like) for every > Address Family (AF). Multiple RIBs per AF is not widely implemented and I > don=E2=80=99t see it becoming more prevalent. Hence, I agree it should be= a > feature. The one implementation I=E2=80=99m familiar with is multiple top= ology > routing (e.g., RFC 4915), where RIB corresponds to a FIB that is selected > based on packet marking. Does anyone have any other examples? Another example could be a separate RIB for RPF, to be used e.g. by PIM. > > This would imply that RIBs are within a routing-instance and that It seems (Junos experts, please confirm) that in Junos user-defined routing tables can be specified both globally and per routing-instance: http://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/junos14.2/topics/reference/confi= guration-statement/export-rib-edit-routing-options.html >From the viewpoint of the data model, I think it is generally easier for an implementation to restrict access to each RIB to a single routing instance than allow different routing instances to share a RIB, if each RIB would have to be inside a routing instance. Lada > routing-protocols within the routing-instance can operate on these RIBs. > There is no requirement connect RIBs to routing-protocols or to form > connections between RIBs. > > This would give us a high-level hierarchy of: > > rw routing-instance* [name] > | +--rw address-family > | | |--rw default-rib* [address-family] > | | +--rw non-default-ribs (feature) > | +--rw routing-protocols > | +=E2=80=95--rw routing-protocol* [type name] > > I intensionally left out the interfaces since I don=E2=80=99t like some m= odels > augmenting or referencing the ietf-interface list and others augmenting or > referencing the list in our rtg-cfg draft. > > Thanks, > Acee > > > > > On 2/18/15, 6:36 AM, "Thomas Morin" wrote: > >>Hi Acee, Lada, >> >>It seems that my comment that you quote was more related to filters than >>to routing tables, and indeed, *filters* were moved from "router" to >>"global" in revision -03 that followed my review. >> >>Additionally, Lada, you say that based on my comments "in rev. -03 the >>list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") was the moved out of the >>routing instance (then called "router") and became global.". But if I >>look at -03, "routing-table" is still a child of "router". The change >>to make "routing-table" global was made in -05. >> >>I guess you need to find out what was the motivation for the change in >>-05, a few months after my initial comments were address. >> >>Best, >> >>-Thomas >> >> >> >> >> >>2015-02-13, Acee Lindem (acee): >>> >>> Hi Lada, Thomas, >>> >>> On 2/13/15, 5:10 AM, "Ladislav Lhotka" wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: >>>> >>>>> Hi Thomas, >>>>> >>>>> It is my understanding that the RIBs were moved out of the >>>>> routing-instance in response to your comment that a RIB would need to >>>>>be >>>>> attached to multiple routing instances. I don=C2=B9t agree with this >>>>> model. I >>>> >>>> Acee refers to this comment that Thomas made in his review of >>>> draft-ietf-netmod-routing-cfg-02 on 2012-03-23: >>>> >>>> "Allowing multiple "routers" is a good starting point for using these >>>> specs in the context of RFC4364 (MPLS/BGP IP VPNs). However, if I >>>> understand correctly Yang syntax, the way the filters are defined would >>>> not work in the context of RFC4364, where a BGP routing instance in the >>>> master "router" exports selected routes in each of the routing table of >>>> each VPN (VRF). The VRF also export routes to the master instance." >>>> >>>> And indeed, in rev. -03 the list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") >>>> was the moved out of the routing instance (then called "router") and >>>> became global. >>> >>> Then do you agree to move the RIBs back into the routing-instance? Both >>> the BGP YANG drafts model L3VPN definitions under the corresponding >>> address family in BGP. >>> >>> http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-shaikh-idr-bgp-model-00.txt >>> http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00.txt >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Acee >>> >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Lada >>>> >>>>> believe that a routing instance implies a VRF, virtual router or >>>>> something >>>>> in between and that a RIB should be associated with one and only one >>>>> routing instance. Additionally, I feel that RIBs are basically passive >>>>> entities with respect to import/export of routes between RIBs in the >>>>> same >>>>> or other routing-instances. Rather, all import/export is under the >>>>> control >>>>> of a routing-protocol. For example, this would be handled by a BGP >>>>> routing-protocol instance for L3VPNs. >>>>> >>>>> I=C2=B9d like to get the opinions of others on this fundamental aspec= t of >>>>>the >>>>> rtg-cfg model. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Acee >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >>>> PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C >>> >>> >>> >> > > --=20 Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Mon Feb 23 11:31:53 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A88301A3BA6; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 11:31:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.911 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.911 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tPylhY1_D-Ph; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 11:31:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.tail-f.com (mail.tail-f.com [83.241.162.140]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0276B1A1B87; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 11:31:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (host-90-237-135-209.mobileonline.telia.com [90.237.135.209]) by mail.tail-f.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 198A9128048E; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 20:31:48 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 20:31:40 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <20150223.203140.655664249325530031.mbj@tail-f.com> To: lhotka@nic.cz From: Martin Bjorklund In-Reply-To: References: <14011_1423852286_54DE42FE_14011_2207_1_D103AD28.E652%acee@cisco.com> <54E47928.8050108@orange.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 6.5 on Emacs 24.3 / Mule 6.0 (HANACHIRUSATO) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Cc: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org, thomas.morin@orange.com, acee@cisco.com, rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (PLEASE REPLY TO THIS ONE WITH THE CORRECT MAIL ALIASES) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 19:31:51 -0000 Ladislav Lhotka wrote: > Thomas Morin writes: > > Additionally, Lada, you say that based on my comments "in rev. -03 the > > list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") was the moved out of the > > routing instance (then called "router") and became global.". But if I > > look at -03, "routing-table" is still a child of "router". The change > > to make "routing-table" global was made in -05. > > > > I guess you need to find out what was the motivation for the change in > > -05, a few months after my initial comments were address. > > Yes, you are right, it seems the immediate motivation for this change > was this review by Martin Bjorklund: > > http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/netmod/current/msg06962.html I don't really understand what exactly in this review led to that change? /martin From nobody Mon Feb 23 11:51:48 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FC771A6EF0; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 11:51:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.361 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.361 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HELO_EQ_CZ=0.445, HOST_EQ_CZ=0.904, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VBF_9nHeOI8y; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 11:51:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.nic.cz (mail.nic.cz [IPv6:2001:1488:800:400::400]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8A9AF1A6EE8; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 11:51:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from [IPv6:2a01:5e0:29:ffff:54ad:feb6:3ad3:9330] (unknown [IPv6:2a01:5e0:29:ffff:54ad:feb6:3ad3:9330]) by mail.nic.cz (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 24D461439D9; Mon, 23 Feb 2015 20:51:43 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=nic.cz; s=default; t=1424721103; bh=SNw2gcIa7oYnKAB02JsliocrcuQ84snZamQwe/53F7g=; h=Content-Type:Mime-Version:Subject:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-Id:References:To; b=Nx8yAY9sr/S5RpEv1APTo782NZc0H8NIrgGawZ6IfS81fzf6c9IXqyssPwjXiVP4d BhoMjMRXMna/NtURJsVA35GFy4EpqWHl8PrIOdi5W1Tzwmole983/1qcxXs0YvpZVE t+dM+2SHMsyTCfSPMI6TTMC6oyj1/4z3+PzBwyJY= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2070.6\)) From: Ladislav Lhotka In-Reply-To: <20150223.203140.655664249325530031.mbj@tail-f.com> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 20:51:44 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7A0379E8-AFA9-4DCB-B5D5-1148985778E0@nic.cz> References: <14011_1423852286_54DE42FE_14011_2207_1_D103AD28.E652%acee@cisco.com> <54E47928.8050108@orange.com> <20150223.203140.655664249325530031.mbj@tail-f.com> To: =?utf-8?Q?Martin_Bj=C3=B6rklund?= X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2070.6) X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.98.1 at mail X-Virus-Status: Clean Archived-At: Cc: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org, thomas.morin@orange.com, acee@cisco.com, rtgwg@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (PLEASE REPLY TO THIS ONE WITH THE CORRECT MAIL ALIASES) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2015 19:51:46 -0000 > On 23 Feb 2015, at 20:31, Martin Bjorklund wrote: >=20 > Ladislav Lhotka wrote: >> Thomas Morin writes: >>> Additionally, Lada, you say that based on my comments "in rev. -03 = the=20 >>> list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") was the moved out of the=20= >>> routing instance (then called "router") and became global.". But if = I=20 >>> look at -03, "routing-table" is still a child of "router". The = change=20 >>> to make "routing-table" global was made in -05. >>>=20 >>> I guess you need to find out what was the motivation for the change = in=20 >>> -05, a few months after my initial comments were address. >>=20 >> Yes, you are right, it seems the immediate motivation for this change >> was this review by Martin Bjorklund: >>=20 >> http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/netmod/current/msg06962.html >=20 > I don't really understand what exactly in this review led to that > change? Last bullet about sec. 5.2: o 5.2 list recipient-routing-table { ... leaf name { type leafref { path "/routing/router/routing-tables/" + "routing-table/name"; } This should also be a relative path. A relative path would make sense only if the leafref points within the = same router (later renamed to routing-instance). Consequently, it would = be impossible to pass routes between tables in different routers. On the other hand, the global path as shown above could lead to = ambiguous references, because different routers could have = routing-tables with identical names. I therefore decided to keep the global path but make sure the names of = routing tables are globally unique. Having a single list of = routing-tables was the most straightforward way to achieve this. Lada >=20 >=20 > /martin -- Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Tue Feb 24 10:29:06 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FFEC1A8790; Tue, 24 Feb 2015 10:29:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.578 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.578 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, IP_NOT_FRIENDLY=0.334, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mlYhgKZ1_JwS; Tue, 24 Feb 2015 10:29:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from slice.pfrc.org (slice.pfrc.org [67.207.130.108]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CB401A1BE8; Tue, 24 Feb 2015 10:29:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by slice.pfrc.org (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 839DCC212; Tue, 24 Feb 2015 13:28:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2015 13:28:59 -0500 From: Jeffrey Haas To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" Message-ID: <20150224182859.GB13211@pfrc> References: <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Ladislav Lhotka , Andy Bierman , Xufeng Liu , Routing WG Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2015 18:29:01 -0000 [I'm behind as usual and this may have been discussed already.] On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 06:07:11PM +0000, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Independent of the hierarchy, I think an interface should be associated > with one and only routing-instance. I know of no implementation that > allows this (including the use case of separate instances for IPv4 and > IPv6). While junos does have the interface as part of the routing instance interface hierarchy, you're also correct in that junos enforces that the interface is only associated with one instance. The question is with regard to generic modeling: Should a single unified interface model with the ability to associate the interface with the instance? Should the instance refer to interfaces? My concern with making the interface model point to associated instances is how we handle versioning for unknown things that we may want to associate that interface with. The interface model is something we want to be rock solid stable, not something that needs to be revised each time some new instancing mechanism is created. -- Jeff From nobody Wed Feb 25 17:56:56 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DF631A92E6; Wed, 25 Feb 2015 17:56:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TtlqwSBZaBt4; Wed, 25 Feb 2015 17:56:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from alln-iport-4.cisco.com (alln-iport-4.cisco.com [173.37.142.91]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6B57B1A92E8; Wed, 25 Feb 2015 17:56:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=1907; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1424915812; x=1426125412; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:content-id:content-transfer-encoding: mime-version; bh=ZbMIS/botL/nh6/b8r0vsuKWY7sfclEkr1g+d6jPJdo=; b=nLRY8MHx236ifj3qleVD13v7Bk3D8OijUo7Vptt3Ft3PCesPzNzJa93W JItRibFPCPqFdKmyqwO5idgpcGiNE9bFqH6130u21SEKSRLdjoa/gMnWj FZIEE9sFO//SLVo1Ej5vZbuRZx026FH4NQOxWwTc+/0Du886Nzmv4Gtjl o=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0C0BQBPfO5U/4YNJK1bgwKBLATJFAKBJ0MBAQEBAQF8hBABAQR5EAIBCA4KLjIlAgQOBYgv1V4BAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBGYsThDszB4QrBYoihUGJRYEbjmiDPiKDbm+BRH8BAQE X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,649,1418083200"; d="scan'208";a="127034622" Received: from alln-core-12.cisco.com ([173.36.13.134]) by alln-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP; 26 Feb 2015 01:56:52 +0000 Received: from xhc-aln-x10.cisco.com (xhc-aln-x10.cisco.com [173.36.12.84]) by alln-core-12.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t1Q1upoq017226 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Thu, 26 Feb 2015 01:56:51 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.175]) by xhc-aln-x10.cisco.com ([173.36.12.84]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Wed, 25 Feb 2015 19:56:51 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Jeffrey Haas Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances Thread-Index: AQHQRxj77tD6GUYxhkmEAnTuReZw3pzuxUwAgAAm/wCAAAYLAIARo4+AgAG7o4A= Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 01:56:51 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> <20150224182859.GB13211@pfrc> In-Reply-To: <20150224182859.GB13211@pfrc> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.197] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-ID: <3AC23F9F9DD99644917DC9408F96BC75@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Ladislav Lhotka , Andy Bierman , Xufeng Liu , Routing WG Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 01:56:54 -0000 On 2/24/15, 1:28 PM, "Jeffrey Haas" wrote: >[I'm behind as usual and this may have been discussed already.] > >On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 06:07:11PM +0000, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >> Independent of the hierarchy, I think an interface should be associated >> with one and only routing-instance. I know of no implementation that >> allows this (including the use case of separate instances for IPv4 and >> IPv6).=20 > >While junos does have the interface as part of the routing instance >interface hierarchy, you're also correct in that junos enforces that the >interface is only associated with one instance. > >The question is with regard to generic modeling: Should a single unified >interface model with the ability to associate the interface with the >instance? Should the instance refer to interfaces? > >My concern with making the interface model point to associated instances >is >how we handle versioning for unknown things that we may want to associate >that interface with. The interface model is something we want to be rock >solid stable, not something that needs to be revised each time some new >instancing mechanism is created. Since what I=B9m suggesting is having rtg-cfg augment the interface model, = I don=B9t understand your concern. Why is the new model having a separate lis= t of interfaces any more =B3rock solid=B2 than the existing interface to reference the associated routing instance? My concern is much easier to understand - with existing configuration information augmenting the RFC 7223 model and some new subset of configuration information augmenting the interface list, we have a bifurcated extension model. Independent of which way we decide to proceed, this issue needs to be addressed lest we have confusion every time a new model needs to augment interface configuration. Acee=20 > >-- Jeff From nobody Thu Feb 26 00:43:45 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 357061A1B4A; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 00:43:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_74=0.6] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hrMp4juXEcr7; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 00:43:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from trail.lhotka.name (trail.lhotka.name [77.48.224.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52CF51A1B17; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 00:43:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [195.113.220.110]) by trail.lhotka.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5A4931CC006E; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 09:43:48 +0100 (CET) From: Ladislav Lhotka To: "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Jeffrey Haas In-Reply-To: References: <20150114155450.GA3625@elstar.local> <20150114174655.GA3932@elstar.local> <20150224182859.GB13211@pfrc> User-Agent: Notmuch/0.19 (http://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/24.4.51.2 (x86_64-apple-darwin14.0.0) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 09:43:37 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Cc: "rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org" , Routing WG , Juergen Schoenwaelder , Andy Bierman , Xufeng Liu Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] issue :R03: assignment of interfaces to routing instances X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 08:43:44 -0000 "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: > On 2/24/15, 1:28 PM, "Jeffrey Haas" wrote: > >>[I'm behind as usual and this may have been discussed already.] >> >>On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 06:07:11PM +0000, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >>> Independent of the hierarchy, I think an interface should be associated >>> with one and only routing-instance. I know of no implementation that >>> allows this (including the use case of separate instances for IPv4 and >>> IPv6).=20 >> >>While junos does have the interface as part of the routing instance >>interface hierarchy, you're also correct in that junos enforces that the >>interface is only associated with one instance. >> >>The question is with regard to generic modeling: Should a single unified >>interface model with the ability to associate the interface with the >>instance? Should the instance refer to interfaces? >> >>My concern with making the interface model point to associated instances >>is >>how we handle versioning for unknown things that we may want to associate >>that interface with. The interface model is something we want to be rock >>solid stable, not something that needs to be revised each time some new >>instancing mechanism is created. > > Since what I=C2=B9m suggesting is having rtg-cfg augment the interface mo= del, I > don=C2=B9t understand your concern. Why is the new model having a separat= e list > of interfaces any more =C2=B3rock solid=C2=B2 than the existing interface= to > reference the associated routing instance? Acee is right - it is an augment and its data belong to a different namespace, so it really doesn't affect the interface model. Actually, I think it would be done the same way (via an augment from another module) even if we envisioned from the start that the assignment of interfaces to routing instances will be done inside the interface hierarchy.. My concern regarding the change that Acee proposes is that this schema extension cannot be made specific so that only a subset of interfaces (L3) can be assigned to routing instances - at least I don't know how to do it formally in the data model. The problem has to do with the fact that interfaces of all layers and types are kept in the same flat list. > > My concern is much easier to understand - with existing configuration > information augmenting the RFC 7223 model and some new subset of > configuration information augmenting the interface list, we have a > bifurcated extension model. Independent of which way we decide to If it is the other way around, one could then argue that the routing-instance configuration is bifurcated. I think both ways are possible in principle, and are just a matter of taste, or perhaps legacy CLI considerations. > proceed,this issue needs to be addressed lest we have confusion every > time a new model needs to augment interface configuration. I agree, we have to make a choice. Lada > > Acee=20 > > > > >> >>-- Jeff > --=20 Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Thu Feb 26 11:29:39 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A83041A1AF0; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 11:29:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.302 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.302 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8VYoPvz6Cd_t; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 11:29:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from na01-bn1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-bn1bon0731.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fc10::1:731]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1A2741A049C; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 11:29:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from CO1PR05MB427.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.141.74.12) by CO1PR05MB428.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.141.74.15) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.93.16; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 19:29:02 +0000 Received: from CO1PR05MB427.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([169.254.12.147]) by CO1PR05MB427.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([169.254.12.147]) with mapi id 15.01.0093.004; Thu, 26 Feb 2015 19:29:02 +0000 From: Dean Bogdanovic To: Ladislav Lhotka Thread-Topic: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (Indentation in hierarchy corrected) Thread-Index: AQHQS74c5g8pGC6LyU+IJwKVns4gSJz+Oz6AgAUiOIA= Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 19:29:02 +0000 Message-ID: <06F5B0A6-15D4-4AD2-8C74-A46AF5C84E46@juniper.net> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-mailer: Apple Mail (2.1510) 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PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: juniper.net does not designate permitted sender hosts) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: juniper.net X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 26 Feb 2015 19:29:02.0666 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: bea78b3c-4cdb-4130-854a-1d193232e5f4 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CO1PR05MB428 Archived-At: Cc: Routing YANG , "EXT - thomas.morin@orange.com" , "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Routing WG Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (Indentation in hierarchy corrected) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2015 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X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+IFJ0Zy15YW5nLWNvb3JkIG1haWxpbmcg bGlzdA0KPiBSdGcteWFuZy1jb29yZEBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9t YWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL3J0Zy15YW5nLWNvb3JkDQoNCg== From nobody Fri Feb 27 03:49:59 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1C8B1A9175; Fri, 27 Feb 2015 03:49:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zJbOV2VJ0LxH; Fri, 27 Feb 2015 03:49:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from trail.lhotka.name (trail.lhotka.name [77.48.224.143]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B0A41A00CA; Fri, 27 Feb 2015 03:49:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (unknown [195.113.220.110]) by trail.lhotka.name (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 432421CC0156; Fri, 27 Feb 2015 12:49:52 +0100 (CET) From: Ladislav Lhotka To: Dean Bogdanovic In-Reply-To: <06F5B0A6-15D4-4AD2-8C74-A46AF5C84E46@juniper.net> References: <06F5B0A6-15D4-4AD2-8C74-A46AF5C84E46@juniper.net> User-Agent: Notmuch/0.19 (http://notmuchmail.org) Emacs/24.4.51.2 (x86_64-apple-darwin14.0.0) Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 12:49:53 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Cc: Routing YANG , "EXT - thomas.morin@orange.com" , "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , Routing WG Subject: Re: [Rtg-yang-coord] rtg-cfg hierachy (Indentation in hierarchy corrected) X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 11:49:57 -0000 Dean Bogdanovic writes: > On Feb 23, 2015, at 8:05 AM, Ladislav Lhotka wrote: >>=20 >>>=20 >>> This would imply that RIBs are within a routing-instance and that >>=20 >> It seems (Junos experts, please confirm) that in Junos user-defined >> routing tables can be specified both globally and per routing-instance: >>=20 >> http://www.juniper.net/documentation/en_US/junos14.2/topics/reference/co= nfiguration-statement/export-rib-edit-routing-options.html > > Lada, > > Not sure what are you are getting at. In Junos you create rib-groups I am trying to figure out whether it is absolutely safe to assume that every RIB can be confined to a single routing instance - Acee proposed to make "ribs" a child of "routing-instance" whereas now it is global (a child of "routing"). Lada > and within rib-groups multiple RIBs can be specified. A RIB group is a > way to have a routing protocol, place information in multiple route > tables. And then you are exporting from rib-group RIBs to RIBs within > routing-instances. Or vice versa, importing from RIBs in > routing-instances into rib-groups. > > This is a special case in my opinion. > > Dean >>=20 >>> routing-protocols within the routing-instance can operate on these RIBs. >>> There is no requirement connect RIBs to routing-protocols or to form >>> connections between RIBs. >>>=20 >>> This would give us a high-level hierarchy of: >>>=20 >>> rw routing-instance* [name] >>> | +--rw address-family >>> | | |--rw default-rib* [address-family] >>> | | +--rw non-default-ribs (feature) >>> | +--rw routing-protocols >>> | +=E2=80=95--rw routing-protocol* [type name] >>>=20 >>> I intensionally left out the interfaces since I don=E2=80=99t like some= models >>> augmenting or referencing the ietf-interface list and others augmenting= or >>> referencing the list in our rtg-cfg draft. >>>=20 >>> Thanks, >>> Acee >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On 2/18/15, 6:36 AM, "Thomas Morin" wrote: >>>=20 >>>> Hi Acee, Lada, >>>>=20 >>>> It seems that my comment that you quote was more related to filters th= an >>>> to routing tables, and indeed, *filters* were moved from "router" to >>>> "global" in revision -03 that followed my review. >>>>=20 >>>> Additionally, Lada, you say that based on my comments "in rev. -03 the >>>> list of RIBs (then called "routing-table") was the moved out of the >>>> routing instance (then called "router") and became global.". But if I >>>> look at -03, "routing-table" is still a child of "router". The change >>>> to make "routing-table" global was made in -05. >>>>=20 >>>> I guess you need to find out what was the motivation for the change in >>>> -05, a few months after my initial comments were address. >>>>=20 >>>> Best, >>>>=20 >>>> -Thomas >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> 2015-02-13, Acee Lindem (acee): >>>>>=20 >>>>> Hi Lada, Thomas, >>>>>=20 >>>>> On 2/13/15, 5:10 AM, "Ladislav Lhotka" wrote: >>>>>=20 >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> "Acee Lindem (acee)" writes: >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Hi Thomas, >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> It is my understanding that the RIBs were moved out of the >>>>>>> routing-instance in response to your comment that a RIB would need = to >>>>>>> be >>>>>>> attached to multiple routing instances. I don=C2=B9t agree with this >>>>>>> model. I >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Acee refers to this comment that Thomas made in his review of >>>>>> draft-ietf-netmod-routing-cfg-02 on 2012-03-23: >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> "Allowing multiple "routers" is a good starting point for using these >>>>>> specs in the context of RFC4364 (MPLS/BGP IP VPNs). However, if I >>>>>> understand correctly Yang syntax, the way the filters are defined wo= uld >>>>>> not work in the context of RFC4364, where a BGP routing instance in = the >>>>>> master "router" exports selected routes in each of the routing table= of >>>>>> each VPN (VRF). The VRF also export routes to the master instance." >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> And indeed, in rev. -03 the list of RIBs (then called "routing-table= ") >>>>>> was the moved out of the routing instance (then called "router") and >>>>>> became global. >>>>>=20 >>>>> Then do you agree to move the RIBs back into the routing-instance? Bo= th >>>>> the BGP YANG drafts model L3VPN definitions under the corresponding >>>>> address family in BGP. >>>>>=20 >>>>> http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-shaikh-idr-bgp-model-00.txt >>>>> http://www.ietf.org/id/draft-zhdankin-idr-bgp-cfg-00.txt >>>>>=20 >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Acee >>>>>=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> Lada >>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> believe that a routing instance implies a VRF, virtual router or >>>>>>> something >>>>>>> in between and that a RIB should be associated with one and only one >>>>>>> routing instance. Additionally, I feel that RIBs are basically pass= ive >>>>>>> entities with respect to import/export of routes between RIBs in the >>>>>>> same >>>>>>> or other routing-instances. Rather, all import/export is under the >>>>>>> control >>>>>>> of a routing-protocol. For example, this would be handled by a BGP >>>>>>> routing-protocol instance for L3VPNs. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> I=C2=B9d like to get the opinions of others on this fundamental asp= ect of >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> rtg-cfg model. >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> Acee >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>>=20 >>>>>>=20 >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >>>>>> PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C >>>>>=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>=20 >> --=20 >> Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs >> PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Rtg-yang-coord mailing list >> Rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-yang-coord > --=20 Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs PGP Key ID: E74E8C0C From nobody Fri Feb 27 08:27:18 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rtg-yang-coord@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 231051A1B86; Fri, 27 Feb 2015 08:27:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4m7PUGNgKegV; Fri, 27 Feb 2015 08:27:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from rcdn-iport-3.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-3.cisco.com [173.37.86.74]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7C85C1A0275; Fri, 27 Feb 2015 08:27:15 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=1748; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1425054436; x=1426264036; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:content-id:content-transfer-encoding: mime-version; bh=DkAeKY8j/IhzTgUj61qRS4/biObFl+5OM81MyYD8Kgw=; b=QbmrfOqIyntgVN0/m2wLK98/Y91PjM2iGSbsUYU7+Kg2uRZhcQ5ZSxt7 Ez/saXjZ3f80rbqjhhtjJ0jcwzSfKMOy16FkqFfei0s2HPFEkrGTsc44t 5TBGFW9Z6FLxgZ4/DlylWgIa4/d53F+Mkj0hJFNYDzOSZzZqsV5OHAp1b s=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0BjBQBxmvBU/4kNJK1bgwJSVQUEwhyFbgKBJU0BAQEBAQF8hBABAQQ6PQIQAgEINhAyGwEGAwIEAQ0FCYgmCAXXLwEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAReLEoRuB4QrBY92g1+FZoEaOYJmjxsjg25vAYFDfwEBAQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,660,1418083200"; d="scan'208";a="399687926" Received: from alln-core-4.cisco.com ([173.36.13.137]) by rcdn-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP; 27 Feb 2015 16:27:15 +0000 Received: from xhc-aln-x07.cisco.com (xhc-aln-x07.cisco.com [173.36.12.81]) by alln-core-4.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t1RGREiC025822 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Fri, 27 Feb 2015 16:27:14 GMT Received: from xmb-aln-x06.cisco.com ([169.254.1.175]) by xhc-aln-x07.cisco.com ([173.36.12.81]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Fri, 27 Feb 2015 10:27:14 -0600 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Routing YANG , "yang-coord@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: New Version Notification for draft-acee-rtg-yang-key-chain-01.txt Thread-Index: AQHQUqlsWZ87StqUs0egD4BzqcuVvZ0Ev+qA Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 16:27:13 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20150227162108.17130.2852.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <20150227162108.17130.2852.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "Alvaro Retana \(aretana\)" , Alia Atlas , Jeff Tantsura Subject: [Rtg-yang-coord] FW: New Version Notification for draft-acee-rtg-yang-key-chain-01.txt X-BeenThere: rtg-yang-coord@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "\"List to discuss coordination between the Routing related YANG models\"" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2015 16:27:17 -0000 FYI - I will be presenting in the RTG WG. On 2/27/15, 11:21 AM, "internet-drafts@ietf.org" wrote: > >A new version of I-D, draft-acee-rtg-yang-key-chain-01.txt >has been successfully submitted by Acee Lindem and posted to the >IETF repository. > >Name: draft-acee-rtg-yang-key-chain >Revision: 01 >Title: Key Chain YANG Data Model >Document date: 2015-02-27 >Group: Individual Submission >Pages: 14 >URL: =20 >http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-acee-rtg-yang-key-chain-01.txt >Status: =20 >https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-acee-rtg-yang-key-chain/ >Htmlized: =20 >http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-acee-rtg-yang-key-chain-01 >Diff: =20 >http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-acee-rtg-yang-key-chain-01 > >Abstract: > This document describes the key chain YANG data model. A key chain > is a list of elements each containing a key, send lifetime, accept > lifetime, and algorithm. By properly overlapping the send and accept > lifetimes of multiple key chain elements, keys and algorithms may be > gracefully updated. By representing them in a YANG data model, key > distribution can be automated. Key chains are commonly used for > routing protocol authentication and other applications. In some > applications, the protocols do not use the key chain element key > directly, but rather a key derivation function is used to derive a > short-lived key from the key chain element key. > > =20 > =20 > > >Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of >submission >until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > >The IETF Secretariat >