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[10:12:40] <bharat.josh> Testing
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[11:26:35] <Pavan Kurapati> testing
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[14:55:51] --- LOGGING STARTED
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[16:06:08] <JJMB> jabber scribe here
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[16:06:17] <JJMB> welcome to dhc WG at IETF70
[16:06:30] <JJMB> administrivia
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[16:07:00] --- marka has joined
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[16:07:24] <JJMB> dhc meeting is scheduled to be on ietf70 channel7 http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf707.m3u available here: http://videolab.uoregon.edu/events/ietf/ietf70.html
[16:07:32] <JJMB> rfc3942 update
[16:07:33] --- jlcjohn has joined
[16:07:42] <JJMB> dhc-subnet-alloc (option code 220)
[16:07:52] <JJMB> draft-raj-dhc-tft-addr-option
[16:08:05] <JJMB> going to register option codes with IANA
[16:08:13] --- raj has joined
[16:08:30] <JJMB> other uses are known 1) etherboot
[16:08:36] <JJMB> there is another
[16:08:55] <JJMB> update from volz on option code 150
[16:09:48] <JJMB> stig stepping down as WG co-chair
[16:10:00] <JJMB> AD and Ralph Droms seeking new co-chair
[16:10:09] <JJMB> rfc3942 update from volz
[16:10:35] <JJMB> RFC 3942 status update B. Volz 05 minutes
[16:11:01] --- arifumi has joined
[16:11:06] <JJMB> need IANA updates
[16:11:40] <JJMB> options have been used but never defined using an ID
[16:12:15] --- David Hankins has left: Logged out
[16:12:18] <JJMB> one option should not be reused option 177 for packetcable
[16:12:24] <JJMB> replaced by option 122
[16:12:28] <JJMB> 177 may still be in use
[16:12:35] <JJMB> PXE linux are in process of being published
[16:12:58] --- SuzanneW has joined
[16:13:11] <JJMB> email to dhc WG re etherboot
[16:13:39] <JJMB> there is some overlap with PXE boot with Etherboot
[16:13:56] <JJMB> 150 conflict is pending
[16:14:01] --- xiaohunhun has joined
[16:14:07] <JJMB> other conflicts re-hashed
[16:14:46] <JJMB> replacements for conflicts need to be defined
[16:14:56] --- john.zhao has joined
[16:16:07] <JJMB> ralph asks - have any conflicts been seen in the field?
[16:16:47] <JJMB> ted lemon at microphone
[16:17:31] <JJMB> recommends moving forward and leave conflict resolution to those who identify issues
[16:17:52] <JJMB> richard johnson at mic
[16:18:13] <JJMB> option 150 started being used a while ago
[16:18:23] <JJMB> DRAFT has been available from the beginning
[16:18:48] <JJMB> etherboot stuff was started a while ago but never completed
[16:18:51] <JJMB> anyone from etherboot in the WG meeting - no
[16:18:57] <JJMB> anyone on the jabber
[16:19:20] <JJMB> lemon and volz recommend to minimally document
[16:19:32] <JJMB> nice ring tone
[16:19:40] <JJMB> played in the WG mtg
[16:20:14] <JJMB> how do we get IANA to remove stale tentative assigned reservations? volz and WG co-chairs working with AD to resolve
[16:20:21] <JJMB> hankins at the mic
[16:20:31] <JJMB> mentions more than need to be added
[16:20:33] <JJMB> 175-177
[16:20:34] <JJMB> ?
[16:21:05] <JJMB> richard johnson is up next
[16:21:38] <JJMB> with kim kinnear
[16:21:47] <JJMB> vpn option draft changes
[16:21:57] <JJMB> changed option definitions
[16:21:59] <JJMB> fixed typos
[16:22:14] <JJMB> option format updated
[16:22:33] <JJMB> discussing justification for relay agent sub-option
[16:23:30] <JJMB> draft needs to go through WG last call
[16:23:39] <JJMB> prior to moving fwd
[16:23:57] <JJMB> DRAFT requires review
[16:24:23] <JJMB> go to https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/70/materials.html for meeting materials
[16:24:47] <JJMB> volz volunteered to review drafts from johnson and kinnear
[16:25:14] <JJMB> kinnear is up
[16:25:48] <JJMB> update on agent-vpb-id-05
[16:25:58] <JJMB> oops vpb s/b vpn
[16:26:05] <JJMB> some clean up
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[16:26:28] <EvanHunt> title is missing a "-dhc-". http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dhc-agent-vpn-id-05.txt
[16:26:37] <JJMB> handkins at the mic
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[16:27:05] <JJMB> if server does not support sub-option it will echo the same regardless of support
[16:27:15] <JJMB> hankins pointing this out -- kinnear acks
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[16:28:19] <JJMB> kinnear is done
[16:28:31] <JJMB> batter up - dhcp container option
[16:28:35] <JJMB> ralph droms
[16:28:41] --- Ted Lemon has joined
[16:29:11] <JJMB> some security issues sent to ralph
[16:29:13] <JJMB> on this draft
[16:29:19] <JJMB> re-wrote some sections - some updates
[16:29:45] <JJMB> describing container option
[16:29:50] <JJMB> for dhcpv4/6
[16:30:24] <JJMB> subsidiary server MUST not always pass along container options
[16:30:36] <JJMB> local policy on sibsdidiary server dictates
[16:30:41] <JJMB> fixed typos
[16:30:58] <JJMB> who read draft on jabber?
[16:31:09] <JJMB> anyone -- buehler?
[16:31:37] <JJMB> unanimous acceptance in the WG mtg to take this item on
[16:31:42] <JJMB> will verify on WG mailing list
[16:31:43] <JJMB> :)
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[16:32:01] <JJMB> stapp is up to discuss bulking leasequery
[16:32:36] <JJMB> not many in room read the ID
[16:33:04] <JJMB> desc of rfc5007
[16:33:38] <JJMB> used a bit in DOCSIS deployments
[16:33:48] <JJMB> some challenges specific to dhcpv6
[16:34:00] <JJMB> reference to route injection
[16:34:15] <JJMB> and related data lifetime
[16:34:15] <JJMB> etc
[16:34:55] <JJMB> requirement exists to facilitate bulk recovery of data
[16:35:01] <JJMB> bulk lq uses TCP
[16:35:29] <JJMB> former concepts using udp were considered complex
[16:35:56] <JJMB> query types are listed new to bulking lq
[16:35:59] --- simoneruffino has left
[16:36:08] <JJMB> notion of relay-id to identify relay agent is specified
[16:36:39] <JJMB> desc use of bulk lq
[16:36:43] <JJMB> for dhcpv6
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[16:36:52] <JJMB> status
[16:36:54] <JJMB> update
[16:37:20] <JJMB> rfc5007 queries should also be supported - ID has no text
[16:37:24] <JJMB> will put in?
[16:37:36] <JJMB> discussion on list regarding connection mgmt
[16:38:21] <JJMB> mixing and matching tcp and udp
[16:38:27] <JJMB> if question requires tcp to reply
[16:38:30] <JJMB> what to do?
[16:38:36] <JJMB> next steps?
[16:38:41] <JJMB> scribe going to mic
[16:39:02] <Ted Lemon> main question is is this a working group item or not?
[16:39:38] <Ted Lemon> John: query by remote ID question, and then query relating to link address, leasequery that might go across multiple relay agents.
[16:40:10] <Ted Lemon> Mark: If this is useful for DOCSIS and most important identifier not addressed, we definitely should add that, not much point in inventing the mechanism of not useable by service providers.
[16:40:30] <Ted Lemon> John: others useful, but need remote id. would increase useability for us.
[16:41:17] <JJMB> thx ted for scribing
[16:41:34] <JJMB> volz at mic
[16:41:49] <JJMB> not sure how to desc bernie's first question
[16:42:28] <JJMB> second question
[16:42:31] <JJMB> from bernie
[16:42:35] <JJMB> address connectivity issues
[16:42:40] <JJMB> to ensure it is available
[16:42:42] <JJMB> lemon at mic
[16:42:57] <JJMB> point about database keys for lookups
[16:43:18] <JJMB> queries should be for keys really needed
[16:43:20] <JJMB> explicitly
[16:43:36] <JJMB> stapp not wanting to create a universal query type
[16:43:47] <JJMB> queries will be specified as required
[16:44:00] <JJMB> specific queries will be defined
[16:44:16] <JJMB> then register new queries as they are defined
[16:44:20] <JJMB> hankins at mic
[16:44:28] <JJMB> authentication
[16:44:32] <JJMB> question -- what else?
[16:44:47] <JJMB> ipsec?
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[16:45:17] <Ted Lemon> john: dunno if you can assume there's going to be secure connectivity.
[16:45:32] <Ted Lemon> john: in relay agent itself, provider configures where they go.
[16:46:06] <JJMB> need to smith text for security
[16:46:37] <JJMB> accepted WG item
[16:46:39] <JJMB> thx mark
[16:46:55] <JJMB> next up ... l2 relay agent
[16:47:09] <JJMB> a handful of readers of the draft
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[16:47:35] <JJMB> history of draft
[16:47:49] <JJMB> multiple drafts created post chicago
[16:48:13] <JJMB> current draft desc general architecture
[16:48:27] <JJMB> what is a l2 relay agent being presented
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[16:48:46] <JJMB> specific to dsl networks...
[16:48:51] <JJMB> if i heard correctlu
[16:48:53] <JJMB> correctly
[16:49:40] <JJMB> comparing l2ra to l3ra
[16:49:45] <JJMB> ra == relay agent
[16:50:57] <JJMB> going through network scenarios
[16:51:05] <JJMB> #1 is done, #2 is up
[16:51:28] <JJMB> next steps?
[16:51:38] <JJMB> accepted as WG item?
[16:51:43] <JJMB> question from david from lucent?
[16:52:06] <JJMB> question is this wg considering something similar for dhcpv6?
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[16:52:19] <JJMB> hankins at mic
[16:52:39] <JJMB> dhcpv6 should be defined
[16:52:42] <JJMB> lemon
[16:53:14] <JJMB> this ID is documenting what is happening ie informational -- not standards based
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[16:53:32] <JJMB> new standards work may be forthcoming
[16:54:17] <JJMB> ip address scarcity and configuration challenges are motivation
[16:54:23] <JJMB> for this ...
[16:54:33] <JJMB> line forming at mic
[16:54:36] <JJMB> erik
[16:54:39] <JJMB> ar mic
[16:54:40] <JJMB> at mic
[16:55:47] <JJMB> erik suggest this that this practice and technology may have practical applications elsewhere not just in DSL
[16:56:07] <JJMB> stapp at mic
[16:56:07] --- sftcd has joined
[16:56:10] <JJMB> work is valuable
[16:56:16] <Pavan Kurapati> we generalised the draft to be non-dsl specific.
[16:56:19] <JJMB> used heavily and undocumented
[16:56:22] <JJMB> use of vendor specific
[16:56:36] <Pavan Kurapati> the draft doesnt talk about dsl specific things anymore
[16:56:44] <JJMB> mark has concerns with some details
[16:56:49] <JJMB> presenter made reference to DSL
[16:56:58] <JJMB> as did many asking questions
[16:57:20] <Pavan Kurapati> yes, current implementation is there in dsl..
[16:57:40] <Pavan Kurapati> but as many mentioned it will be useful in other domains as well
[16:57:43] <Bharat Joshi> This is inspired by DSL implementations but applicable to other areas as well...
[16:57:45] <JJMB> agreed
[16:57:49] <JJMB> no doubt
[16:57:57] <JJMB> scribed this above
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[16:57:58] <JJMB> ;)
[16:58:31] <JJMB> stapp advocated accepting as WG item
[16:58:40] <JJMB> lucent guy is up again
[16:58:46] <JJMB> work has been done in DSL forum
[16:58:50] <JJMB> relatedto this
[16:58:55] <Bharat Joshi> Yes...
[16:59:20] <JJMB> he agrees that introduction of support for ipv6 is important?
[17:00:01] <JJMB> WG folks hmm'd to take on as WG item
[17:00:32] --- dhankins has joined
[17:00:32] <JJMB> ...
[17:01:07] <JJMB> benoit lourdelet is up to discuss NTP options for DHCPv6
[17:01:38] <JJMB> decent # of people read the draft
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[17:02:45] <JJMB> over of ntp
[17:02:48] <JJMB> requirememts
[17:03:01] <JJMB> advertise ntp location and configure ntp parameters
[17:03:21] <JJMB> zero touch is desirable
[17:03:41] <JJMB> ipv6 address vs fqdn support
[17:03:42] <JJMB> or both
[17:04:38] <JJMB> benoit describing an unfortunately ntp DoS some years back
[17:06:57] <JJMB> question about option constructs
[17:07:25] <JJMB> flags approach could be overly complex
[17:07:33] <mg> just put in an address and let the dhcp server resolve it if the admin provides a name. It can send a new address on renew if needed later right? :)
[17:07:34] <JJMB> lemon at mic
[17:08:03] <JJMB> ted suggests that the ntp server option should be a list
[17:08:23] --- JJMB has left
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[17:09:38] <JJMB> sorry adium barfed
[17:10:05] <JJMB> going to ask question to WG from jabber
[17:10:07] <JJMB> stand by
[17:10:25] <JJMB> haberman at mic
[17:10:33] <JJMB> server list seems desirable
[17:10:47] <JJMB> ntp WG is going to handle this item mainly
[17:11:01] --- Bharat Joshi has left
[17:11:06] <JJMB> dhc WG need to be involved
[17:11:14] <mg> Addresses are good for one reason: If you have not yet set your time, how can you use DNSSEC? :)
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[17:11:27] <JJMB> hankins at mic
[17:11:38] <JJMB> what is difference b/w sntp and ntp
[17:11:44] <JJMB> benoit describing
[17:12:33] --- sftcd has left
[17:13:15] <mg> thank you for reading my questions. I guess I should just stand up next time :)
[17:13:20] <JJMB> doh
[17:13:22] <JJMB> yeah if ur here
[17:13:31] <JJMB> brutal :)
[17:13:33] <mg> I was walking to the mic when you started talking, ahh well :)
[17:13:42] <JJMB> lol
[17:13:44] <JJMB> nice
[17:14:11] <JJMB> co-author richard at mic
[17:16:53] <JJMB> out of time for ntp
[17:16:58] <JJMB> heading to ntpwg
[17:17:19] <JJMB> need representatives from dhcwg to help with ntpwg effort
[17:17:37] <JJMB> service identifiers next
[17:17:54] <JJMB> requirements overview
[17:19:09] --- Pavan Kurapati has left
[17:19:18] <JJMB> option format
[17:19:45] <JJMB> potential candidates
[17:19:54] <JJMB> reviewing shane kerr's comments
[17:21:51] <JJMB> seems to apply to wireless broadband and related mobile technology
[17:22:16] <JJMB> lemon to the mic
[17:22:56] <JJMB> is this practical
[17:22:56] <JJMB> ?
[17:23:06] <JJMB> since the list either way can be very large
[17:23:14] <JJMB> a register for service identifiers may be required
[17:23:32] <JJMB> need to specify identifier len
[17:25:42] <JJMB> stapp at the mic
[17:25:46] <JJMB> draft is not complete
[17:25:51] --- yoshi has joined
[17:26:04] <JJMB> how will this info make it to device to be used
[17:26:08] <JJMB> ?
[17:26:52] <JJMB> jari at mic
[17:27:00] <JJMB> expressing concerns about walled gardens
[17:27:12] <JJMB> where different services are available
[17:27:47] <JJMB> configuration issues could exist
[17:28:49] <JJMB> volz is last comment
[17:29:01] <JJMB> agrees DRAFT seems incomplete
[17:30:05] <JJMB> chairs suggest a new revision prior to WG considering as WG item
[17:30:44] <JJMB> jari indicates that this DRAFT will likely not be taken on by dhc WG
[17:30:50] <JJMB> perhaps a different WG
[17:31:14] <JJMB> certificate option for dhcp for dhcpv6 pd
[17:31:18] <JJMB> droms presenting
[17:31:23] <JJMB> overview
[17:31:53] --- histerrier has left
[17:31:56] <JJMB> who read the DRAFT?
[17:32:11] <JJMB> some read it
[17:32:15] <JJMB> not many
[17:32:20] <JJMB> draft is related to SEND
[17:33:21] <JJMB> challenges with passing cert in dhcp msg
[17:33:30] <JJMB> could become large
[17:34:29] <JJMB> desire to automate cert dist
[17:35:45] <JJMB> support for multi-mode for cert delivery
[17:35:49] <JJMB> in packet or pointer
[17:36:13] --- kshu has joined
[17:36:43] <JJMB> this is defined as an IA_PD option
[17:37:21] <JJMB> preso is done
[17:37:34] <JJMB> stig asking question
[17:37:47] <JJMB> what would the pointer be?
[17:37:51] <JJMB> cert could be too big
[17:37:56] <JJMB> francis dupont
[17:37:58] <JJMB> at mic
[17:38:25] <JJMB> sending cert
[17:38:31] <JJMB> is not desirable
[17:38:42] <JJMB> francis mentioned
[17:39:17] <JJMB> jari at the mic
[17:40:08] <JJMB> what others key requirements are there?
[17:40:19] <JJMB> getting key to router
[17:40:32] <JJMB> lemon at mic
[17:40:53] <JJMB> could this be used for dynamic injection of routes?
[17:40:56] <JJMB> jari again
[17:41:17] <JJMB> mentions a BoF related to SEND
[17:41:25] --- raj has joined
[17:41:31] <JJMB> and compatibility between dhcp and send?
[17:41:52] <JJMB> SEND CGA BoF at IETF this week
[17:42:07] <JJMB> if a WG is formed dhc WG could collaborate
[17:42:10] <JJMB> with them
[17:42:42] <JJMB> where will actual work occur?
[17:42:55] <JJMB> to discuss with AD offline
[17:43:20] <JJMB> next....rebind capability
[17:44:05] --- vfajardo has joined
[17:44:16] <JJMB> required by DOCSIS
[17:44:28] <JJMB> author re-wrote alot this morning
[17:44:31] <JJMB> new draft is available
[17:44:37] <JJMB> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dhc-dhcpv6-reconfigure-rebind-03.txt
[17:45:20] --- miyahiro has joined
[17:46:38] <JJMB> several outstanding questions
[17:46:47] <JJMB> need to be addressed
[17:46:50] <JJMB> heading to mailing list
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[17:47:09] <JJMB> next nd information over dhcp
[17:47:28] --- arifumi has left: Disconnected
[17:49:02] <JJMB> use dhcp to send nd options
[17:50:21] <JJMB> to encourage code reuse
[17:51:24] <JJMB> alain durand
[17:51:32] <JJMB> this could be creating complexity
[17:51:34] <JJMB> jari agrees
[17:51:47] <JJMB> alain suggests just creating what is needed from RA in DHCPv6
[17:52:26] <JJMB> prefix length has been discussed as a potential option
[17:52:53] <JJMB> suresh replied
[17:53:05] <JJMB> suggests that problem does not g oaway
[17:53:44] <JJMB> alain mentions that ra's could not be used in general
[17:53:46] <JJMB> volz at mic
[17:55:37] <JJMB> shin miyagawa at mic
[17:56:29] <JJMB> shin suggests not expanding RA
[17:56:43] <JJMB> and using dhcp to deliver additional options
[17:56:54] <Ted Lemon> isn't this kind of like shouting "fire" in a crowded theatre?
[17:57:01] <JJMB> LOL
[17:57:21] <mg> only if you think there really should be two config methods :)
[17:57:30] <mg> Or you think dhcp should not exist.
[17:58:25] <JJMB> putting options in dhcp would avoid the need to change base host behavior
[17:58:28] <JJMB> allow for reuse
[17:58:34] <JJMB> hemant singh
[17:58:37] <JJMB> at mic
[18:00:13] <JJMB> hankins at mic
[18:00:52] <JJMB> all done mtg adjounred
[18:00:54] --- dhankins has left
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[18:00:57] <JJMB> adjourned
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