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Tuesday, March 12, 2013< ^ >
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[20:55:11] john joins the room
[21:01:00] Wes George joins the room
[21:01:02] heycengiz joins the room
[21:01:34] <Wes George> any remote participants?
[21:01:47] <heycengiz> Hi Wes, I am remote
[21:02:04] <Wes George> audio ok?
[21:02:16] <heycengiz> yes
[21:02:20] <Wes George> we're reviewing http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/86/slides/slides-86-grow-0.pdf
[21:02:20] <Wes George> slide 2
[21:03:03] <Wes George> slide 3
[21:04:06] <Wes George> slide 5
[21:04:06] <Wes George> slide 6
[21:05:03] <Wes George> slide 8
[21:05:22] <Wes George> slide 9
[21:05:29] <Wes George> slide 10
[21:06:23] <Wes George> slide 11
[21:06:59] <Wes George> slide 132
[21:06:59] russmundy joins the room
[21:06:59] <Wes George> 12
[21:07:17] <Wes George> slide 13
[21:07:26] <Wes George> slide 14
[21:08:05] <Wes George> slide 16
[21:08:22] <Wes George> slide 17
[21:09:29] <russmundy> speaker is often garbled - mic probably too close to mouth??
[21:09:32] <Wes George> joel jaeggli - why is this a policy violation (slide 16)
[21:09:32] <Wes George> it has a covering aggregate
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[21:10:25] <Wes George> john scudder - referring to slide 13
[21:10:25] dyork leaves the room
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[21:12:23] <Wes George> sorry, I'm not following this well enough to summarize
[21:12:24] <russmundy> could someone in the room ask the speaker to move their mic away from their mouth?
[21:12:56] <Wes George> the presenter, or joel?
[21:12:57] <Wes George> or both?
[21:13:02] <danyork> Pierre Francos at the mic
[21:13:03] <russmundy> presenter
[21:13:20] <Wes George> ack
[21:13:25] <russmundy> if the presenter is speaking now, its much better
[21:13:29] bradd joins the room
[21:13:57] <russmundy> tks
[21:14:45] <Wes George> back to slide 17
[21:15:12] <Wes George> slide 18
[21:15:39] Dan York leaves the room
[21:16:29] <Wes George> slide 20
[21:16:38] <Wes George> danny mac
[21:17:02] <Wes George> in the opsec wg there is a bgp operational security draft, talks a lot about filtering
[21:17:09] <Wes George> don't like blindly filtering on ranges
[21:17:37] <Wes George> generally useful work,
[21:18:01] <Wes George> john - this is traffic engineering and very basic bgp behavior
[21:18:23] <Wes George> the language should be clarified to remove threat/violation
[21:18:47] <Wes George> ruediger volk - i have seen things happening where policy violations happened due to traffic engineering
[21:19:16] <Wes George> would like to see something that gives me formal criteria to really identify such situations
[21:19:17] <Wes George> there are many occasions where one cannot avvoid
[21:20:00] <Wes George> if a customer connects in various regions over the globe, I will have a hell of a time to force that customer to do consistent announcements everywhere
[21:20:01] <Wes George> therefore I can't do consistent announcements to my peerse
[21:20:35] Juan Pedro Cerezo joins the room
[21:20:51] <Wes George> a: problem is that you neeed information from your neighbors
[21:20:59] <Wes George> joel - i advertise a covering aggregate to a regional provider
[21:21:06] <Wes George> I also advertise more specifics to the same provider
[21:21:07] <Wes George> this is normal behavior
[21:21:19] <Wes George> I might not advertise the covering aggregate to peers, but I will advertise more specifics
[21:21:20] <Wes George> how is this a policy violations
[21:22:02] <Wes George> east cost vs west coast with different specifics but same covering aggregate
[21:22:49] <Wes George> peter s - the issue they're bringing up is that AS2 is able to manipulate the traffic to get revenue from as0
[21:23:04] <Wes George> joel - then AS2 and AS1 have a business problem
[21:23:14] <Wes George> joel so they're accepting a prefix that they shouldn't be
[21:24:42] <Wes George> jeff haas
[21:24:42] <Wes George> agree that violation is not the right word
[21:24:56] <Wes George> one of the questions is how do you infer whether this is meant to happen?
[21:25:10] <Wes George> without some sort of policy database, it's hard to do, without looking glasses at every point
[21:26:02] <Wes George> joel - what you're talking about is a game theory problem - use that terminology
[21:27:15] <Wes George> morrow - WG drafts updates
[21:27:50] <Wes George> some naming issues in the drafts we adopted, working to update
[21:28:39] <Wes George> meeting ends
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