IETF
IASA 20
iasa20@jabber.ietf.org
Tuesday, February 28, 2017< ^ >
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[11:03:53] <sftcd> complicated slide that omits all the sub-cttes complexity:-)
[11:04:13] <Alissa Cooper> could only fit so much on one slide
[11:04:49] <Jari Arkko> we're very glad to get this good crowd on the call today — but i think everyone on the webex list is quite familiar with the system
[11:05:53] <sftcd> slide 8 bullet 3 touches on that doesn't it?
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[11:14:39] <sftcd> what was the protocol for hand-raising? (sorry I was dropped for a min while you all negotiated that;-)
[11:14:55] <wood> Raise hand using Webex faciliity
[11:15:05] <wood> Or put hand up in webex chat
[11:15:09] <ldaigle@techark.org> or, if you don't have that, speak briefly to get Gonzalo's attention
[11:15:21] <sftcd> yeah I don't see that in the webrtc UI
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[11:21:39] <sftcd> I thought that "transparency" would've been a top level bullet on some slide - am I missing it somewhere?
[11:21:59] <sftcd> or should we just raise it for every slide? :-)
[11:22:01] <Alissa Cooper> it's in the first bullet
[11:22:32] <sftcd> yeah, maybe I expected a full slide on that or something
[11:27:15] <sftcd> we need to get an F for Fear into the name of some IAOC/IASA thing:-)
[11:32:56] <Lars> +1 to randy
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[11:34:38] <sftcd> I didn't really expect asking for a lack of clarity to resonate, but nonetheless I'd hate us to lose that;-)
[11:37:52] <Lars> can hear stephen fine, but gonzalo broke up bad
[11:37:59] <ldaigle@techark.org> I'd like clarity that institutionalizes that accessibility  to all participants
[11:38:05] <ldaigle@techark.org> @Lars — me too
[11:38:54] <sftcd> @leslie: if we can do it well without risking the benefits of our current lack of clarity then that'd be good, might be tricky though
[11:39:15] <ldaigle@techark.org> tricky, no doubt.  
[11:39:23] <ldaigle@techark.org> but i agree on the importance
[11:40:16] <sftcd> on slide 10, I bet we all agree that the current setup ain't great, I'd be interested in hearing if someone did think it was great (e.g. that IAB chair is on there etc)
[11:41:01] <ldaigle@techark.org> the IAB chair on the committee has been useful
[11:41:04] <ldaigle@techark.org> i'd argue important
[11:41:08] <ldaigle@techark.org> possible less so going forward
[11:41:32] <ldaigle@techark.org> but, generally, i don't think it's great if the IAOC is meant to do discussion work
[11:43:14] <Sean Turner> srsly?
[11:43:31] <ldaigle@techark.org> how else can they overthrow the whole system?
[11:43:49] <ldaigle@techark.org> <not serious>
[11:43:49] <Sean Turner> :)
[11:43:54] <ldaigle@techark.org> :-)
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[16:04:25] <Mat Ford> i see 'Recording…\
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[16:13:21] <Jari Arkko> Good point, Robert
[16:13:42] <Alissa Cooper> is the point that there isn't any trouble finding enough volunteers for tools and network?
[16:13:56] <RjS> it's _different_
[16:14:12] <RjS> sometimes there's trouble, but it's not the same kind of impedence
[16:14:17] <JoeHallCDT> can you mute Avri for her?
[16:14:33] <JoeHallCDT> ty
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[16:24:16] <spencerdawkins> I could know this, but I don't. The ADs for most areas hold office hours at some point during meeting weeks, to allow people to corner us and raise concerns, and ask for guidance. Does the IAOC do anything like that during meeting weeks?
I'm sympathetic to Bob's point that the community doesn't have a lot of visibility (and that solving that problem shouldn't require plenary time) ...
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[16:27:35] <Jari Arkko> i'd break the issue into three: 1/ community knowing more 2/ ability to affect things (e.g., know stuff early enough that you can have an effect in a decision) 3/ this translating to bigger willingness to participate in IAOC input/work/etc. but i also agree with alissa's "may be unreasonable to rely on volunteers" problem.
[16:27:51] <jason livingood> good point, Alissa.
[16:28:16] <RjS> jari - that division makes sense to me
[16:28:42] <Mat Ford> +1 Jari
[16:28:49] <Jari Arkko> also lik Mat's and Dave's point re: knowing what's coming up and something like last calls
[16:29:01] <RjS> telegraphing (saying what you will do, doing what you will say) will still be important even if the staffing model is radically different
[16:29:26] <Alissa Cooper> agree Robert and agree with Dave's comments
[16:29:53] <Joel Halpern> Arguably, forward-looking transparency is even more important if there is more paid staff.  Staff mean well, but can accidentally fall into an operational capture pattern, as it makes their job much easier.
[16:31:45] <RjS> hard to get traction on this bucket - conflated with other things later
[16:37:41] <Jari Arkko> Good question, Jason
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[16:47:58] <spencerdawkins> I'm hoping that we can think about the costs of having the IETF and IAB chairs as members of things, as well as the benefits ...
[16:49:01] <JoeHallCDT> what paper?
[16:49:06] <JoeHallCDT> Jari's?
[16:49:16] <JoeHallCDT> ah, Leslie's
[16:49:17] <ldaigle@techark.org> draft-daigle-iasa-retrospective i think
[16:49:18] <Russ Housley> I assume that was a reference to Jari's paper
[16:49:25] <JoeHallCDT> ty
[16:49:38] <Ray Pelletier> Daigle paper
[16:49:42] <Alissa Cooper> yeah I think https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-daigle-iasa-retrospective-00 — jari's draft doesn't touch on this
[16:51:06] <Suzanne> The funding issue is the big one for me— the mismatch between our funding model and our ability to evolve our working methods
[16:51:42] <Suzanne> But all the issues people have been discussing here make it harder to promote the endowment or otherwise address this
[16:57:09] <Bob> Suzanne:  Start charging for RFCs :-)
[16:57:20] <Suzanne> :-P
[16:57:21] <Mat Ford> AUTH48 should include a pointer to PayPal ;-)
[16:58:00] <akatlas> Expanding the pool of interested and relevant organizations - both for participation & for sponsoring
[16:59:03] <Jari Arkko> the draft that i mentioned is https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arkko-ietf-finance-thoughts-00
[16:59:40] <Suzanne> @jari haven't read it yet, will do though :)
[17:00:25] <akatlas> +1 to Gonzalo - and the risk to being a meeting sponsor reputation for getting it wrong
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[17:01:25] <Suzanne> +1 to Gonzalo, and noting that selling meeting sponsorships provides an incentive to people to find ways to *add* importance and activity to meetings
[17:01:57] <Alissa Cooper> are hosts expected to do t-shirts, social, etc. because historically they wanted to? or because we didn't have staff to do it? or for some other reason?
[17:02:13] <ldaigle@techark.org> I think:
[17:02:18] <ldaigle@techark.org> some have wanted to (and still do)
[17:02:28] <ldaigle@techark.org> because the IETF expects them
[17:02:36] <ldaigle@techark.org> s/IETF/IETF participants/
[17:03:04] <Alissa Cooper> thanks
[17:04:37] <RjS> we lose jari?
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[17:07:10] <RjS> where are the recordings and the roster for the first session?
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[17:07:28] <Alissa Cooper> they have not been posted yet I don't think
[17:07:41] <cmorgan> Both sessions were recorded on my account; I can forward them to the list
[17:08:09] <RjS> thanksf
[17:08:12] <Alissa Cooper> thank you! if we can get them posted to the datatracker page also that would be great if feasible
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