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Thursday, July 21, 2016< ^ >
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[07:54:09] oej joins the room
[07:55:14] oej has set the subject to: ICE @ IETF96 Berlin | Need relay? Prefix with mic: | Scribe: OEJ
[07:55:26] Meetecho joins the room
[07:55:40] <oej> Hello Meetecho! Welcome to Nordic ICE!
[07:57:09] Satish Kanugovi joins the room
[07:57:13] Daniel Burnett joins the room
[07:57:25] oej is now known as oej - SCRIBE
[07:58:14] <oej - SCRIBE> The Note Well applies to remote participation - please read and understand https://www.ietf.org/about/note-well.html
[07:58:41] <oej - SCRIBE> Documents at https://datatracker.ietf.org/group/ice/documents/
[07:59:03] <oej - SCRIBE> Agenda at https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/96/agenda/agenda-96-ice
[08:00:23] <oej - SCRIBE> Materials (slides, cool downloads, cat pictures) https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/96/session/ice
[08:00:35] <oej - SCRIBE> (Maybe I promised too much ;-) )
[08:01:29] Satish Kanugovi leaves the room
[08:01:42] <oej - SCRIBE> *** Slide: Agenda
[08:02:02] Joe Canadas joins the room
[08:02:20] Ross Finlayson joins the room
[08:02:20] <oej - SCRIBE> *** Slide: WG Status
[08:03:24] <oej - SCRIBE> — Next presentation: Christer Holmberg draft ice-bis
[08:03:29] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide: Agenda
[08:04:17] <oej - SCRIBE> slide: 3 BA decisions implemented
[08:04:26] <oej - SCRIBE> We are not aggressive any more
[08:04:39] <oej - SCRIBE> The room is slowly filling up
[08:04:56] Chris Wendt joins the room
[08:04:59] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil Ivov speaking at mic
[08:05:51] <oej - SCRIBE> If you want to participate remotely, please use meetecho virtual queues. If you're not on meetecho, then prefix your statement with mic:
[08:05:54] Alissa Cooper joins the room
[08:05:57] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[08:06:10] <oej - SCRIBE> "If you don't receive the check, you don't have consent" - Martin
[08:06:13] ben joins the room
[08:06:21] ben leaves the room
[08:06:21] ben joins the room
[08:06:21] <oej - SCRIBE> consent to send
[08:06:29] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari Keränen from floor (no chair hat)
[08:06:50] <oej - SCRIBE> Note: Emil will check. That's a promise
[08:07:01] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide: 4 BA decisions implemented
[08:07:18] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 5 - BA decisions implemented
[08:07:52] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen Jennings speaking
[08:08:01] Ram Ravindranath joins the room
[08:08:13] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[08:08:19] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen back
[08:09:06] <oej - SCRIBE> "5 milliseconds will not work" - Cullen
[08:09:46] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 6: Other changes
[08:10:56] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 7: Other changes
[08:11:15] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 8: Still to do
[08:11:44] <oej - SCRIBE> slide 9: Still to do
[08:13:17] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter Thatcher - chair hat off
[08:13:32] <oej - SCRIBE> (With no badge. Tss tss)
[08:13:50] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari as chair speaking
[08:13:54] Jonathan Lennox joins the room
[08:14:12] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 10: Still to do
[08:15:30] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 11: The unfreezing checklist problem
[08:15:34] <oej - SCRIBE> New speaker: Emil Ivov
[08:15:56] hta joins the room
[08:18:20] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen Jennings speaking
[08:19:28] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking from mic
[08:20:04] Andrew Hutton joins the room
[08:21:07] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil continuing
[08:21:14] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox back at mic
[08:21:59] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen speaking
[08:23:27] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan back
[08:23:58] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[08:25:48] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan talks about "trickling in order"
[08:26:54] <oej - SCRIBE> "Clear recommendation on trying to trickle in order to … something" - Emil
[08:26:58] <oej - SCRIBE> Tim panton talking
[08:27:04] Ram Ravindranath leaves the room
[08:27:28] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox at mic
[08:27:42] <oej - SCRIBE> "You have to define it" - Jonathan
[08:27:45] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen speaking
[08:27:59] <oej - SCRIBE> We're still on slide 11
[08:28:05] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari speaking as chair
[08:28:12] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[08:28:19] <oej - SCRIBE> Yay for examples!
[08:28:40] <oej - SCRIBE> Does the new RFC format allow for animations? Trickle and freezing / unfreezing
[08:28:50] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil
[08:28:58] <oej - SCRIBE> speaking
[08:29:43] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen Jennings speaking
[08:30:50] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 17: next steps
[08:30:58] <oej - SCRIBE> Showing ICE type pokemons
[08:31:42] <oej - SCRIBE> Next presentation: Cullen Jennings with some real life data- this will be interesting
[08:31:51] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking (as well as chairs)
[08:32:01] <oej - SCRIBE> Chairs putting pressure on WGLC
[08:32:51] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil
[08:33:17] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan and Emil speaking
[08:33:33] Joe Canadas leaves the room
[08:33:47] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen speaking
[08:34:10] <oej - SCRIBE> The draft needs to include "you can quite at any time"
[08:34:22] <oej - SCRIBE> quit at any time
[08:34:31] <oej - SCRIBE> martin thomson speaking
[08:35:22] <oej - SCRIBE> There's soem off-mic discussions, I'll try to correct that
[08:35:45] Joe Canadas joins the room
[08:35:58] Joe Canadas leaves the room
[08:36:01] <oej - SCRIBE> *** Struggling to get speakers to the microphone while having a heated discussion
[08:37:09] Alissa Cooper leaves the room
[08:37:12] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan speaking
[08:37:23] <oej - SCRIBE> Remote contribution: https://imgflip.com/i/17q7co
[08:37:34] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil ivov speaking
[08:38:21] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan speaking
[08:38:34] <oej - SCRIBE> (small gang around the microphone)
[08:39:04] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil wants to make sure that it is clear that we can quit at any time
[08:39:22] <oej - SCRIBE> chair speaking
[08:40:41] <oej - SCRIBE> — Time for Cullen to start his presentation finally
[08:40:46] <oej - SCRIBE> ICE Timing
[08:41:00] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 2: Disclaimer
[08:41:14] <oej - SCRIBE> slide 3: Back at last IETF…
[08:41:32] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 4: Tests
[08:41:59] <oej - SCRIBE> "This devices are amazingly compliant with BEHAVE" - Cullen
[08:42:05] <oej - SCRIBE> slide 5: mapping results
[08:42:21] <oej - SCRIBE> Over a 1000 mappings and less than 10.000 per second
[08:43:02] <oej - SCRIBE> slide 6: Bandwidth results
[08:43:31] <oej - SCRIBE> 100 peer connections in parallell each with one data channel
[08:44:45] <oej - SCRIBE> SLide 7: Bandwidth results
[08:45:44] ben leaves the room
[08:46:19] Alissa Cooper joins the room
[08:46:23] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[08:46:51] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter Thatcher speaking
[08:47:03] Jiri Kuthan joins the room
[08:47:23] <oej - SCRIBE> Still Peter at the mic
[08:47:39] <oej - SCRIBE> suggestions that retransmissions are treated differently
[08:48:08] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[08:48:40] <oej - SCRIBE> When you are driving through pinholes you rely on the second check
[08:48:47] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil Ivov trying to make two points
[08:49:01] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide 9: Proposal
[08:49:06] <oej - SCRIBE> (I must have missed slide 8 or he skipped it)
[08:50:34] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter (as non-chair) speaking
[08:50:46] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari speaking from chair desk
[08:51:41] <oej - SCRIBE> Ben Schwarz at mic
[08:52:20] <oej - SCRIBE> 36 IPv4 and 36 IPv6 candidates - cullen
[08:52:27] <oej - SCRIBE> two interfaces
[08:53:15] <oej - SCRIBE> — slide 7 again (repeat)
[08:54:02] <oej - SCRIBE> — Slide 9 - proposal
[08:54:12] <oej - SCRIBE> (He keeps skipping slide 8 ;-) )
[08:56:25] <oej - SCRIBE> More SDP attributes - keep them coming!
[08:56:36] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter Thatcher (non-chair) floor mic
[08:58:48] <oej - SCRIBE> Tim Panton speaking
[08:59:08] <oej - SCRIBE> Bandwidth or packet count - what applies for wifi ?
[08:59:42] <oej - SCRIBE> "sort of semi-crappy 3g cellular connections" - baseline for Cullen's work
[08:59:46] <oej - SCRIBE> Ben schwarz speaking
[09:00:09] <oej - SCRIBE> A global or per-interface limit?
[09:00:57] <oej - SCRIBE> Wifi to a 3g hotspot in my pocket - the wifi is really good, but the next hop sucks. (interpretation of what Cullen said)
[09:01:21] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking
[09:01:40] <oej - SCRIBE> adding VPN interfaces to the mix
[09:01:48] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[09:02:04] ben joins the room
[09:02:44] <oej - SCRIBE> Do we need to define ICE melting? :-)
[09:03:16] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari Keränen from floor mic (no chair hat)
[09:04:14] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil Ivov speaking
[09:05:15] <oej - SCRIBE> ** Note: REmote particpants - please interact with this group and ask questions. Use meetecho or prefix your statement with "mic:" and I'll relay
[09:06:17] <oej - SCRIBE> Ben Schwartz speaking
[09:06:50] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter Thatcher speaking
[09:07:33] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[09:10:34] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari as chair speaking
[09:11:05] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking again
[09:11:16] <oej - SCRIBE> (They know when they get my evil eye :-) )
[09:11:29] <oej - SCRIBE> — Slide 7 being shown
[09:12:46] <oej - SCRIBE> —- Slide 9 Proposal again
[09:12:55] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking
[09:13:18] <oej - SCRIBE> "This will be an exciting issue with the transport people regardless" - JL
[09:13:59] <oej - SCRIBE> Bernard aboba speaking soon
[09:14:19] <oej - SCRIBE> We're talking leaking ICE buckets now.
[09:14:32] <oej - SCRIBE> DDOS protection and the transport thing - bernard
[09:16:12] <oej - SCRIBE> "Ben can you help us round up some transporty folks" ? Cullen to Ben (AD)
[09:16:20] <oej - SCRIBE> Varun Singh speaking
[09:20:10] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil Ivov speaking
[09:20:20] <oej - SCRIBE> "There's nothing a browser can do to be that smart" - Emil
[09:21:52] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter thatcher from floor
[09:22:32] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[09:22:59] p m joins the room
[09:23:58] <oej - SCRIBE> We need to pick a number and a window where that number is enforced - Martin
[09:24:47] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter thatcher from floor
[09:25:22] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari as chair from floor
[09:25:38] <oej - SCRIBE> Putting pressure on WGLC
[09:26:12] <oej - SCRIBE> ** Slide 9 proposal
[09:27:07] <oej - SCRIBE> Let's take the highest number possible and let the Transport area take it down
[09:27:10] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson
[09:28:52] <oej - SCRIBE> Christer Holmberg speaking
[09:29:35] Jiri Kuthan leaves the room
[09:29:40] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter Thatcher speaking
[09:30:20] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari speaking as chair
[09:30:33] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter as chair
[09:30:37] <oej - SCRIBE> Show of hands
[09:30:44] <oej - SCRIBE> Anyone here in the room
[09:30:54] <oej - SCRIBE> Opposed?
[09:31:05] <oej - SCRIBE> Second question
[09:31:12] <oej - SCRIBE> Any hands?
[09:31:32] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson speaking
[09:32:15] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil Ivov
[09:32:18] <oej - SCRIBE> speaking
[09:33:55] <oej - SCRIBE> ICE SDP https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-mmusic-ice-sip-sdp-09
[09:34:22] Tobias joins the room
[09:34:29] <oej - SCRIBE> EMil speaking
[09:34:41] <oej - SCRIBE> Ben Schwartz speaking
[09:35:09] Alissa Cooper leaves the room
[09:35:35] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin THomson speaking
[09:36:00] <oej - SCRIBE> Christer Holmberg speaking
[09:37:04] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil speaking
[09:37:17] Ray Atarashi joins the room
[09:38:19] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil still speaking
[09:39:26] Ray Atarashi leaves the room
[09:39:47] Ray Atarashi joins the room
[09:39:49] <oej - SCRIBE> JOnathan speaking
[09:40:50] <oej - SCRIBE> — Next presentation: Trickle Ice with our great man Emil Ivov
[09:40:53] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter speaking as chair
[09:42:46] <oej - SCRIBE> Christer spoke
[09:43:26] <oej - SCRIBE> Mo Zanaty speaking
[09:43:52] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox saying "Data channels " ?????
[09:43:57] <oej - SCRIBE> Martin Thomson
[09:45:58] <oej - SCRIBE> Ari as chair reminding us of WGLC
[09:46:20] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox at mic
[09:46:53] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil elegantly avoiding review
[09:46:57] <oej - SCRIBE> ** Laughter **
[09:48:35] <oej - SCRIBE> Marc Petit-Huguenin speaking (co-author of stun-bis)
[09:49:01] <oej - SCRIBE> We need many eyes on ice :-)
[09:49:23] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil gave in for a review position
[09:49:34] <oej - SCRIBE> —- Next presentation: Trickle ICE
[09:49:39] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil Ivov
[09:49:45] ben leaves the room
[09:50:07] ben joins the room
[09:50:09] <oej - SCRIBE> "The best document ever written" - Emil Ivov
[09:50:19] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide #4 - Trickle ICE plus ICE restarts
[09:51:17] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking
[09:52:41] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter Thatcher speaking
[09:53:11] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter is not opposed to people doing smart things
[09:53:14] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan at mic
[09:53:37] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide #5 Unfreezing procedures
[09:55:10] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking
[09:55:35] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide #6 - Update candidate ...
[09:56:35] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide #8 Update candidate...
[09:57:05] <oej - SCRIBE> Christer Holmberg speaking
[09:59:15] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking
[10:01:10] <oej - SCRIBE> Tim Panton speaking
[10:01:43] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox
[10:02:47] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox again
[10:03:59] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide #9 - Anything else we can do for you?
[10:04:06] <oej - SCRIBE> Christer Holmberg speaking
[10:04:49] <oej - SCRIBE> We need a logotype, stickers and hats for trickle ice  if it's the best document ever written. Such an accomplishment!
[10:05:12] <oej - SCRIBE> Christer Holmberg again
[10:05:27] Alissa Cooper joins the room
[10:06:05] <oej - SCRIBE> I am beginning to think I'm lucky that I don't own any part of the ICE code…
[10:06:17] <oej - SCRIBE> —- Presentation done
[10:06:50] <oej - SCRIBE> Tim Panton to do review of trickle ice
[10:07:15] Ross Finlayson leaves the room
[10:07:18] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen spoke
[10:07:59] <oej - SCRIBE> — Next presentation: ICE Mobility
[10:08:03] <oej - SCRIBE> slide: Big question
[10:08:11] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter Thatcher speaking
[10:08:39] <oej - SCRIBE> slide: TURN Mobility is coming
[10:08:45] <oej - SCRIBE> slide. ICE mobility
[10:09:02] <oej - SCRIBE> slide: Ice mobility is needed
[10:09:29] <oej - SCRIBE> define "network interfaces come and go"
[10:09:42] <oej - SCRIBE> we want to avoid flapping ice
[10:09:50] <oej - SCRIBE> slide "general choice"
[10:10:29] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide: Incremental improvements
[10:10:35] <oej - SCRIBE> slide : Network cost - problems
[10:11:46] <oej - SCRIBE> slide. SOlutions
[10:12:15] <oej - SCRIBE> Wifi can lead to cell (remember Cullens talk above)
[10:12:55] <oej - SCRIBE> slide: Problems (sorry, no slide numbers)
[10:14:54] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide: Problems again (sorry, missed one while mailing a rant to the mailing list)
[10:15:00] <oej - SCRIBE> Peter has no name tag and no slide numbers
[10:16:16] <oej - SCRIBE> Slide: Implementation experience
[10:17:13] <oej - SCRIBE> Varun Singh speaking
[10:17:49] <oej - SCRIBE> *** Note: Please use meetecho for remote participation in the discussion. If you're not on Meetecho and need me to relay, prefix with "mic:"
[10:19:31] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen Jennings moving ahead in the queue
[10:20:12] <oej - SCRIBE> Ben schwartz speaking
[10:20:28] <oej - SCRIBE> Varun Singh speaking - ben too
[10:20:45] <oej - SCRIBE> Now Varun
[10:21:31] <oej - SCRIBE> Bernard Aboba speaking
[10:22:27] ben leaves the room
[10:23:42] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil Ivov speaking
[10:24:09] ben joins the room
[10:26:30] <oej - SCRIBE> — Mic line closed
[10:26:36] <oej - SCRIBE> Varun Singh speaking
[10:27:05] Daniel Burnett leaves the room
[10:27:09] <oej - SCRIBE> Göran Eriksson speaking
[10:27:54] <oej - SCRIBE> Cullen Jennings
[10:28:45] <oej - SCRIBE> Proposing a full day workshop about ICE - Next Generation! ??
[10:28:58] <oej - SCRIBE> Expanded to two days
[10:29:03] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking
[10:29:35] ben leaves the room
[10:29:38] <oej - SCRIBE> "That's how SDP got as bad as it is"
[10:29:45] <oej - SCRIBE> Jonathan Lennox speaking
[10:30:07] <oej - SCRIBE> Mo Zanaty speaking
[10:30:35] <oej - SCRIBE> Asking for real world use-cases
[10:30:45] <oej - SCRIBE> Miguel Paris speaking
[10:30:55] Andrew Hutton leaves the room
[10:31:03] <oej - SCRIBE> Emil Ivov gets the last world
[10:31:06] <oej - SCRIBE> soon
[10:31:52] <oej - SCRIBE> Just wanted to have the last word
[10:32:02] <oej - SCRIBE> Thank you all for participating in the ICE meeting!
[10:32:20] <oej - SCRIBE> Note to next scribe: Please change the TOPIC :-) Good luck!
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