[00:00:12] <Jonathan Lennox> (For older H, mutis mutandis)
[00:00:14] <spencerdawkins> Pete - I hope they think it's not :-)
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[00:00:16] <hta> " we don't need another framework " ..... "we don't need another way home" ....
[00:00:40] <ekr@jabber.org> achernya: see above.
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[00:00:42] <sftcd> @ekr: wrt masque-client as a server/packet-router, I think I agree with you but it might just be worth pondering a while before concluding
[00:00:43] <Pete Resnick> @spencer: I was not saying what I thought so as not to influence their comment. ;)
[00:00:49] <ekr@jabber.org> sftcd: sure, that's fine :)
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[00:01:09] <Ben Schwartz> Multiplexing _and discovery_
[00:01:22] <spencerdawkins> @Pete - you're so good ;-)
[00:01:26] <achernya> ekr, I read the above, but I don't find it to answer my question
[00:01:37] <ekr@jabber.org> We already have HTTP3 CONNECT. I just want it to work
[00:01:39] <ek.ietf> so we're not HTTP/3 POSTing individual packets?
[00:01:41] <Pete Resnick> 😇
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[00:01:51] <ekr@jabber.org> with UDP and QUIC
[00:01:58] <lpardue> +1
[00:02:03] <ekr@jabber.org> You wouldn't POST individual packets. You would send them over datagram
[00:02:12] <achernya> HTTP3 CONNECT doesn't work for raw IP or UDP packets
[00:02:20] <ekr@jabber.org> Yes, so you need Unreliable Connect
[00:02:29] <achernya> Okay, but why do you want it to be H3 at that point
[00:02:30] <ekr@jabber.org> and I think the IP thing is bad, so....
[00:02:36] <achernya> the IP thing is critical for VPN
[00:02:39] <ek.ietf> so there's control plane negotations over H3 within the QUIC session and then DATGRAM frames on a different stream?
[00:02:49] <ekr@jabber.org> ek.ietf: yes
[00:02:53] <Mirja> yes
[00:02:58] <achernya> @ek: That's how QBONE works, except we don't use an H3 stream
[00:03:05] <ek.ietf> I think that helps input into which area this might end up in
[00:03:11] <Jonathan Lennox> This sounds a lot like an application running over WebTrans to me, for loose understandings of how WebTrans will work
[00:03:12] <lpardue> well DATAGRAM frames are not on streams
[00:03:19] <ekr@jabber.org> lpardue: yes.:)
[00:03:23] <achernya> they're logically ephemeral streams :)
[00:03:37] <lpardue> ^^ send DATAGRAM frames associated with flows
[00:03:54] <ek.ietf> ah, fair
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[00:04:09] <Jonathan Lennox> (And once you say it's over WebTrans you get the "accessible from Javascript" feature of course.)
[00:04:25] <achernya> I think there's room for WebTrans and MASQUE to end up having the same wire encoding
[00:04:31] <lpardue> STREAM frame contains steam ID, HTTP/3 DATAGRAM frame (schinazi ID) contains flow ID
[00:04:40] <keithmoore> +1 for interest, but IMO WG charter is premature
[00:04:46] <tfpauly> Agreed @achernya
[00:04:56] <Martin Thomson> +1 will contribute
[00:05:12] <Pete Resnick> The webex chat gets saved in the recording, doesn't it?
[00:05:22] <Alissa Cooper> Yes
[00:05:40] <keithmoore> need cross-links between jabber chat log and webex chat log :)
[00:05:46] <Zaheduzzaman Sarker> +1 will contribute and have interest
[00:06:03] <Jonathan Lennox> Both Jabber comments and WebEx comments have timestamps, fortunately.
[00:06:11] <Jonathan Lennox> (Hopefully they'll get stored in the same timezone.)
[00:07:22] <keithmoore> Concur with Ted's voice statement.
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[00:07:36] <keithmoore> (i.e.  no to a WG until the charter is better defined)
[00:09:26] <msk> +1 Ted.h as well
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[00:10:44] <watson17> i wonder if jabber only would work?
[00:10:57] <keithmoore> seems like it would be simpler.
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[00:11:25] <mnot> Again - it's not clear that a charter is what's required here. Figure out the scope of work and then see what places it belongs. Don't presume a new WG>
[00:11:31] <kaduk@jabber.org/barnowl> jabber-only as in no voice at all?
[00:11:51] <keithmoore> kaduk: worth a try.
[00:12:00] <lpardue> thanks all
[00:12:01] <kaduk@jabber.org/barnowl> (I do meetings jabber-only with no voice for openafs and it works okay
for that small-ish group)
[00:12:03] <msk> Thanks everyone
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[00:12:27] <Zaheduzzaman Sarker> bye bye!!
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[00:12:52] <dkg> i've also done text-mode meetings -- they're not too bad as long as there's a clear agenda and a way to move through them
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[00:12:54] <dkg> like meetbot
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[00:13:12] <Jana Iyengar> @mnot: point taken
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