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[22:43:44] <mcr> I guess we don't do bluesheets for plenary, do we?
[22:43:53] <mcr> are we having an etherpad?
[22:44:14] <cvmiller> Yes, there is an etherpad for the plenerary
[22:44:15] <Jared Mauch> I'm just following the same procedure I did for others and put my name in there.
[22:44:15] <Tommy Pauly> There is this: https://etherpad.ietf.org:9009/p/notes-ietf-107-plenary?useMonospaceFont=true
[22:44:17] sginoza joins the room
[22:44:19] <joehall> well, people are doing it anyway: https://etherpad.ietf.org:9009/p/notes-ietf-107-plenary?useMonospaceFont=true
[22:44:25] csperkins joins the room
[22:44:34] <mcr> agenda document has no link.
[22:44:47] <Brian> IIRC we did an etherpad for plenary once
[22:44:56] <Brian> with... predictable consequences
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[22:45:13] <Jared Mauch> if you'd like I can sign your name and donald duck in :-)
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[22:45:27] <Jared Mauch> but please please please don't abuse the etherpad :-)
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[22:45:32] <msk> audio was good
[22:45:33] <ek> sounds good
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[22:45:52] <cvmiller> Etherpad https://etherpad.ietf.org/p/notes-ietf-107-plenary?useMonospaceFont=true
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[22:46:45] <mcr> please use port-9009 etherpad, if you can. the 443 goes through a proxy, and was prone to failing, and the people behind silly firewalls need to use 443. At least, that's what I understand.
[22:46:54] Martin Thomson has set the subject to: IETF 107 Plenary - https://etherpad.ietf.org:9009/p/notes-ietf-107-plenary?useMonospaceFont=true
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[22:47:53] <Jonathan Lennox> What is the link to the Plenary WebEx?
[22:48:01] xp29srs joins the room
[22:48:03] <James Gruessing> https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m80a98c91b91b80ccf8e8477872e9ff06
[22:48:03] <mcr> I put it on the etherpad.
[22:48:10] Alice Russo joins the room
[22:48:17] <Jonathan Lennox> Thanks
[22:48:24] spencerdawkins joins the room
[22:48:26] Brian Carpenter joins the room
[22:48:32] <mcr> and it's on the agenda in the DT, which is also in the calendar :-)
[22:48:35] Mike StJohns joins the room
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[22:49:10] <Jonathan Lennox> Somehow the ics I downloaded to my calendar doesn't have it, even though all the session ones do
[22:49:23] <mcr> yeah, it wasn't in the ICS that I saw either ;-(
[22:49:28] John Scudder joins the room
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[22:49:48] <Warren Kumari> is it silent for everyone, or just me?
[22:49:48] jimsch1 joins the room
[22:49:52] <James Gruessing> silence.
[22:49:52] <brong> silent here
[22:49:54] Russ Housley joins the room
[22:50:01] John Scudder joins the room
[22:50:01] <Jared Mauch> just you warren.. it starts in 1 min anyways :-)
[22:50:05] <jhoyla> Hello darkness my old friend.
[22:50:05] Sean Turner leaves the room
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[22:50:05] <Martin Thomson> silence is golden
[22:50:10] <msk> silence at the moment, audio checks were earlier
[22:50:13] <Warren Kumari> I still maintin we need elevator music....
[22:50:25] <msk> @Martin Thomson: best plenary evar.
[22:50:26] <Jonathan Lennox> Can someone who's supposed to be speaking, speak?
[22:50:27] jhaas joins the room
[22:50:28] <James Gruessing> Silence is not golden if you work in broadcast - alarms generally fire when it happens for too long.
[22:50:29] Pete Resnick joins the room
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[22:50:32] <Jared Mauch> Warren, i'll make my mkids phone you.
[22:50:34] <Martin Thomson> msk: if only
[22:50:38] <Brian> there's elevator music over in the hallway, no?
[22:50:52] <Jonathan Lennox> A lot of hum in whoever was just speaking
[22:50:53] <dhruvdhody> Yeah for a 4 am plenary! kinda feels just like jet lagged in Vancouver!!
[22:50:58] hta joins the room
[22:50:59] <jhoyla> Successful sound check.
[22:51:09] <Brian> wouldn't be an ietf without horrible jet lag :)
[22:51:32] <Jonathan Lennox> First all-mime IETF plenary?
[22:51:43] <Martin Thomson> cabo: mute
[22:51:46] <brong> nice
[22:51:49] <Martin Thomson> thanks :)
[22:51:50] <Brian> elevator music is up
[22:51:54] <Warren Kumari> Hey! I got my elevator music!
[22:52:07] <Warren Kumari> It's new, experimental elevator music, but...
[22:52:09] John Levine joins the room
[22:52:09] <Jonathan Lennox> WebEx's audio system is not kind to elevator music
[22:52:09] <John Scudder> Go stand in an elevator?
[22:52:09] Sean Turner joins the room
[22:52:10] <cabo> Brian Eno, music for the airports
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[22:52:33] Melinda joins the room
[22:52:39] <cvmiller> And there's the elevator music
[22:52:42] <Wes Hardaker> my inability to get in combined with the endless "connecting..." bubble just above "making the Internet work better" is a great source of irony
[22:52:45] guy.fedorkow joins the room
[22:52:48] <jhoyla> Loving the muzak!
[22:52:54] <Jonathan Lennox> bron: what's the source?
[22:52:54] <James Gruessing> Please tell me this music has rights cleared, I don’t want to see the IETF get its first Youtube copyright strike
[22:52:58] Samuel Weiler joins the room
[22:52:59] <Warren Kumari> :-) Thank you 14436 :-)
[22:53:00] <Toerless Eckert> going up to elevator level 107
[22:53:10] Mike Bishop joins the room
[22:53:11] <brong> yeah good point
[22:53:21] Ted Lemon joins the room
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[22:53:33] <Samuel Weiler> secretariat colleagues, can you mute Bron?
[22:53:41] Steve Donovan joins the room
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[22:53:43] <brong> I already muted
[22:53:49] Jonathan Hammell joins the room
[22:53:53] <Martin Thomson> does that fall under fair use: parody ?
[22:53:59] Larry joins the room
[22:54:09] <joehall> I suspect we could fight a 512 takedown in a US jurisdiction pretty easily… not fun, but we’re a pretty sympathetic defendent
[22:54:09] <cabo> I hope so, but YouTube doesn't know about fair use
[22:54:10] Ted Lemon leaves the room
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[22:54:17] <Jonathan Lennox> https://www.bensound.com/royalty-free-music/track/the-elevator-bossa-nova
[22:54:17] <jhoyla> @Martin Thomson :joy: :joy: :joy:
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[22:54:55] <brong> I can give you a few minutes of my cat making his "I see a bird" noise
[22:55:00] <James Gruessing> Am I the only one struggling to download the slides from data tracker?
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[22:55:14] <carrickdb@jabber.hot-chilli.net> brong: yes pls
[22:55:15] <Jonathan Lennox> How's your cat's YouTube IPR enforcement?
[22:55:18] <Martin Thomson> James Gruessing: it would seem not
[22:55:18] Sean Turner leaves the room
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[22:55:23] <cabo> brong: No
[22:55:29] <brong> too late
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[22:55:35] <carrickdb@jabber.hot-chilli.net> :(
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[22:56:02] <Ted Lemon> In the back of my mind there’s an image that there is a plenary stage in a hotel somewhere.  It’s surprisingly strongly believed considering that I know intellectually that it’s not there.
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[22:56:14] <msk> Perhaps we can hear Warren's "I see a bird" noise instead
[22:56:14] Magnus Westerlund joins the room
[22:56:18] <Brian> ted: same
[22:56:19] <cabo> Ted Lemon: +1
[22:56:23] <Jonathan Lennox> Well, there's a ballroom sitting empty in a hotel in Vancouver
[22:56:24] adrianfarrel joins the room
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[22:56:33] <Ted Lemon> There’s an image. :(
[22:56:35] <Jonathan Lennox> They probably didn't set the stage up though
[22:56:35] EricMc joins the room
[22:56:52] <Mike Bishop> Maybe we should just play https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WimbyL_25Nw&feature=youtu.be&t=72 instead.
[22:57:01] Michael leaves the room
[22:57:02] <Brian> i keep being shocked at how small the room Alissa is in sounds
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[22:57:27] <Martin Thomson> Mike Bishop: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ perhaps?
[22:57:32] <jhaas> For any who haven't noticed, the plenary has begun and Alissa is speaking.  If you can't hear, you may want to join alternative audio stream.
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[22:58:05] HK is now known as Hans Kuhn
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[22:58:23] <Brian Carpenter> At least one person is sending video. Please stop!
[22:58:25] EricMc leaves the room
[22:58:26] kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl joins the room
[22:58:26] <brong> I will jabber scribe if needed - just say MIC: here
[22:58:36] EricMc joins the room
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[22:59:00] <Jonathan Lennox> As far as I can tell by comparing names, the person sending video is not here in the Jabber room
[22:59:05] <Martin Thomson> I will name and shame video senders.
[22:59:15] <Martin Thomson> Miao Fuyou is sending video.
[22:59:19] Bob Hinden joins the room
[22:59:34] <Karen O'Donoghue> @brong - I am tapped to do that but… you can wrestle that away from me if you wish...
[22:59:35] <adam> Just wanna thank Bron profusely for taking up the note taking job in so many of these sessions.
[22:59:39] <Brian Carpenter> And they are ignoring private chat
[22:59:40] <Jared Mauch> view -> "Show Participant video" and just uncheck it.
[22:59:51] <Brian Carpenter> Ah no, now it's gone off
[22:59:57] andrew@depht.com joins the room
[22:59:57] <brong> Karen O'Donoghue: oh, you go
[22:59:59] kiran.ietf joins the room
[23:00:05] <Martin Thomson> Jared Mauch: not an option from the web client
[23:00:10] <msk> adam++
[23:00:10] Sean Turner leaves the room
[23:00:28] Victor Kuarsingh joins the room
[23:00:37] <brong> adam: it keeps me awake!
[23:00:47] metricamerica joins the room
[23:01:12] Sean Turner joins the room
[23:01:27] Jay Daley joins the room
[23:02:19] Cathy Aronson joins the room
[23:02:38] <jhoyla> I would argue that this IETF is remarkable, it will certainly be asterisked forever.
[23:02:41] <John Scudder> next, pictures of delicious food we can't eat?
[23:02:43] neednnelg@sure.im leaves the room
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[23:02:43] Steve Feldman leaves the room
[23:02:44] aretana joins the room
[23:02:55] <mcr> way to tease us.
[23:03:04] <msk> i was thinking that
[23:03:14] alexamirante joins the room
[23:03:15] <cvmiller> How do we get such a T-Shirt?
[23:03:20] <brong> we have 4 months to learn how to screen-print
[23:03:24] <Toerless Eckert> living the virtual dream life
[23:03:26] <Andrew Sullivan> There will be pictures of huge cookies later in the deck no doubt!
[23:03:28] <John Scudder> he just said. Come to the next f2f
[23:03:32] ebakoslang@jabb.im joins the room
[23:03:38] <Cullen Jennings> Love the shirt and huge kudos to Huawei
[23:03:55] <John Scudder> yeah, it's one I wouldn't ahve binned
[23:03:56] Ted Lemon joins the room
[23:03:56] Ted Lemon leaves the room
[23:04:00] <Andrew Sullivan> Agree that Huawei's support in this has been pretty great!
[23:04:02] <jhoyla> The eye of the Tao? 道
[23:04:03] <adam> Applause!
[23:04:06] <dhruvdhody> *clap*
[23:04:09] <Alexey Melnikov> Indeed!
[23:04:10] <spencerdawkins> I know this was NOT easy for them - so, double great.
[23:04:11] francesca joins the room
[23:04:11] <m&m> *clap*
[23:04:12] <behcet> I hate black T-shirts
[23:04:14] ChrisBox leaves the room
[23:04:17] <Cullen Jennings> Perfect length host preso
[23:04:19] <msk> You can all imagine a spray of camera shutter sounds and flashes now
[23:04:34] <krose> behcet: thankfully, they become grey t-shirts after a while
[23:04:40] <ek> +1
[23:05:22] Sean Turner leaves the room
[23:05:24] merm leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[23:05:37] merm joins the room
[23:05:59] <jhaas> At some point iaoc should take up prior suggestion to open the ietf webstore on cafepress so old shirts can be insta-printed.
[23:06:00] Sean Turner joins the room
[23:06:08] ChrisBox joins the room
[23:06:16] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> IAOC, the thing that doesn't exist any more?
[23:06:44] <Jay Daley> @jhaas First time I've heard that suggestion - I will take a look.
[23:06:49] <Andrew Sullivan> When there was an IAOC and IAD, there was in fact such a web store, and it cost more to administer than it ever brought in.
[23:06:50] <spencerdawkins> the prior IAOC takes up the prior suggestion ;-)
[23:07:04] <Andrew Sullivan> It was CafePress, I think.
[23:07:12] <Pete Resnick> @kaduk: "IASA" still has a referent.
[23:07:23] <mcr> IAOC = IETF Argh Operations Corporation
[23:07:29] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> Jay: there are some copyright issues with shirt designs, IIRC
[23:07:29] smccammon joins the room
[23:07:32] <jhaas> The prior creator and shirt wrangler for a recent berlin ietf can dig out the email to said prior organization
[23:07:37] <mcr> (I still hate "IETF LLC". It needs a better name)
[23:07:39] <tale > I thought it had something to do with the Olympics
[23:07:44] <cabo> 52 Etherpad, 82 in Etherpad Bluesheet, 271 in Webex
[23:07:51] <mcr> tale, that's IOAC, isn't it?
[23:07:57] <stewart@jabber.today> We removed too much and created the potential for chaotic calanders the next few weeks
[23:08:00] <tale > Shh
[23:08:09] <joehall> mcr: no, it’s done
[23:08:11] <Sean Turner> @mcr I roll with IAL: IETF Administration LLC
[23:08:12] <mcr> so, 271-82 people who don't know how to use etherpad?
[23:08:19] <Martin Thomson> cabo: Etherpad isn't holding up to the strain very well
[23:08:23] <Pete Resnick> People were having some trouble getting in.
[23:08:24] EricMc leaves the room
[23:08:25] Ted Lemon joins the room
[23:08:30] <brong> or failing to load, as MNOT said
[23:08:33] <mcr> IAL is better than IETF LLC.
[23:08:40] <Barry Leiba> Well, we don't normally do blue sheets in the plenary.
[23:08:48] <James Gruessing> Perhaps people who’ve already signed the blue sheet on ether pad should close their tab/window of it.
[23:08:52] <cabo> I still haven't managed to download all PDFs
[23:08:55] EricMc joins the room
[23:08:59] <mcr> (i couldn't remember if we did Blue Sheets in the plenary)
[23:09:00] <Klensin> @Barry: when did we stop?
[23:09:21] <brong> we just assume that everyone is there? :p
[23:09:22] <Barry Leiba> I don't recall doing it in the last 15 years, at least.
[23:09:26] Ted Lemon leaves the room
[23:09:28] <Mike StJohns> *applause*
[23:09:32] <msk> I can't remember ever doing a blue sheet for the plenaries, but it's all such a blur...
[23:09:38] <mcr> *appause*
[23:09:41] <Larry> clap clap clap
[23:09:45] <sftcd> +many
[23:09:49] <Wes Hardaker> standing applause
[23:09:51] <msk> +<3
[23:09:54] <Sean Turner> @msk normally no BS for plenary :)
[23:09:56] <Jim Fenton> @Barry: there were some opinions that we should make NomCom eligibility depend on plenary attendance.
[23:09:57] <Joel Halpern> + many
[23:10:05] Peter Yee joins the room
[23:10:14] <Barry Leiba> We'll have the WebEx attendance, in case that happens.
[23:10:28] <brong> yeah, if WebEx logs it then we could create bluesheets from that
[23:10:29] Sean Turner leaves the room
[23:10:39] <Jay Daley> For reference; My favourite tipple is a Cosmopolitan or a G&T will do
[23:11:05] bensons joins the room
[23:11:19] <mcr> is there a company that delivers?  Ontario LCBO stopped delivery, because Canada Post won't authenticate being 18.  We are just puritans.
[23:11:25] <mcr> we are such puritans.
[23:11:26] Sean Turner joins the room
[23:11:32] <Larry> applause for internet working suprisingly well
[23:11:32] <msk> aww
[23:11:45] neednnelg@sure.im joins the room
[23:11:49] <Pete Resnick> People apparently don't want to follow the "only +/-q in webex" rule.
[23:11:51] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> I hear that liquor stores were deemed essential in several US
jurisdictions, allowed to remain open
[23:12:02] <Mike StJohns> @larry except apparently load limitations for etherpad
[23:12:05] <Andrew Sullivan> Actually, it's 19 in Ontario.  It's 18 in Québec.
[23:12:09] <Sean Turner> @kaduk - tes
[23:12:18] <Martin Thomson> kaduk: with a shortage of hand sanitizer, that's probably true
[23:12:20] <cabo> kaduk@jabber.openafs.org: Where else do you get disinfectant?
[23:12:28] <neednnelg@sure.im> in California they also designated legal pot shops
[23:12:32] <brong> As seen on <socialnetwork> recently. I've just bought 2 week's supply of alcohol for the third time this week
[23:12:47] <John Scudder> @kaduk booze appears to be "essential" in most US jurisdictions. All I've checked including my own.
[23:12:48] mnot joins the room
[23:12:49] <jimsch1> Wineries are deemed in esential in Cal - Need to make that alcohol as well
[23:12:50] <Brian> twentytwentytwenty
[23:12:53] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> cabo: the stock of rubbing alcohol I keep on hand?
[23:13:05] <cabo> My IPA is down to 1 L
[23:13:09] <jimsch1> I have about 10 gallon of Everclear at the winery
[23:13:12] <James Gruessing> @kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl yes, alcohol-dependant people can die if they cold turkey. ER’s quite commonly have beer on standby for it, as well as high proof alcohol (good for countering methanol poisoning)
[23:13:32] <John Scudder> It actually makes sense, if you don't want alcohol-dependent people to start drinking the hand san. :-(
[23:13:37] <adam> John Scudder: They tried closing liquor stores in Denver. It did not go well.
[23:13:59] <adam> They reversed it like four hours later after stores filled up with last minute panic buying
[23:14:06] <mcr> we want people drunk, and not out there driving.
[23:14:12] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> Yes, alcohol withdrawl and DTs are really bad, and our healthcare
providers have other things they need to worry about
[23:14:26] <m&m> it lasted about 2 hours before liquor stores and dispensaries were considered essential in Denver
[23:14:47] mcr giggles
[23:14:56] <brong> should have "remote" for each of the pieces of pie
[23:15:02] <m&m> the surrounding municipalities did not make that mistake
[23:15:03] <brong> that or browser
[23:15:16] <ben@nostrum.com> TX considered liquor stores essential, and change rules to allow restaurants to deliver cocktails
[23:15:20] ChrisBox leaves the room
[23:15:28] <mcr> pie charts are never the right tool... I've read.
[23:15:31] Ted Lemon joins the room
[23:15:36] <brong> cookie charts
[23:15:36] <Joel Halpern> I read that New York liquor board changed the rules to allow restauarants an bars with on-prem liquor licenses to deliver liquor with meals.
[23:15:40] <Brian Carpenter> In NZ we had queues at gunshops before today's lockdown.
[23:15:40] Sean Turner leaves the room
[23:15:41] <Ted Lemon> If we registered for IETF 107 in-person, are we registered?
[23:15:41] <neednnelg@sure.im> there might be a few folks actually based in Vancouver - do they count as a local attendees?
[23:15:51] <adam> Joel: Texas did the same thing
[23:15:51] <Jonathan Lennox> Yeah, New York has to-go coctails now
[23:15:54] <Pete Resnick> @ted: Yes.
[23:15:55] <John Scudder> I can neither confirm nor deny that in Michigan one can get delivery cocktails as long as one answers the magic question correctly. The magic question being "are you a cop?"
[23:15:55] <mcr> yes, everyone got converted to remote.
[23:15:56] <brong> Ted yes
[23:16:00] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> I heard gun sales were up in St. Louis as well, with talk of looting
[23:16:10] <dkg> to be fair, we have tried closing down all alcohol vendors in the US in the past.  it didn't go well.  see amendments 18 and 21
[23:16:15] <Larry> registration didn't ask for T-shirt size (and gender for T-shirt style)
[23:16:31] Sean Turner joins the room
[23:16:36] Ted Lemon leaves the room
[23:16:41] <James Gruessing> @Brian Carpenter did you not just have a gun amnesty? Are people just upgrading?
[23:16:43] <adam> APPLAUSE
[23:16:57] <brong> +1
[23:17:02] <jhaas> @larry the shirt size distribution is largely ignored in the process of the host.
[23:17:05] <Klensin> @Kaduk: Ben, it doesn't look like anyone else has mentioned this, but your posts are coming in with line-wrapping at about 5 characters.  Wasn't happening in gendispatch so you might check if something changed.
[23:17:39] MarcoSIDN@Home joins the room
[23:17:59] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> @Klensin: I had to change jabber accounts since my main connection
fell over.  I am not sure where the wrapping would be happening,
though, as it shows up fine here
[23:18:04] <ben@nostrum.com> BenK's posts look normal to me
[23:18:12] <sureshk@jabber.org> @jhaas: not sure about other hosts but I paid serious attention the three times I was in the host team
[23:18:19] <lpardue> they read like haiku's to me
[23:18:20] <krose> It would be better if they wrapped at syllables, like a haiku
[23:18:24] <krose> lol
[23:18:42] <RjS> it'll wrap for anyone who has a client that honors embedded html
[23:18:43] Ted Lemon joins the room
[23:18:49] <John Scudder> They look fine here. Shall we re-run the "my client is better" thread? :-)
[23:18:53] <Klensin> @ben,, and @ben.  I'm using an odd client, so maybe the problem is here -- if others aren't seeing it, not to worry.
[23:18:54] <brong> wrapping for me, I have a narrow window to leave space for etherpad
[23:19:05] <ben@nostrum.com> Ah, that's one of the things I love about Adium—it ignores that stuff
[23:19:08] <jhaas> @sureshk the trends, certainly.  but the pre-reg numbers come late to influence the order
[23:19:15] cvmiller joins the room
[23:19:22] <msk> I'm seeing wrapping at around 70 characters for @kaduk
[23:19:23] <jhaas> @sureshk and also we don't track actuals in a useful way
[23:19:29] <nemo> This is a trivial question, but did we write our names on the blue sheet at every plenary meeting?
[23:19:40] <brong> nemo: apparently not
[23:19:41] cvmiller leaves the room
[23:19:42] <Ted Lemon> I’ve never done it before.
[23:19:44] <brong> my mistake
[23:19:54] <Ted Lemon> Might make more sense this time because we are all remote.
[23:19:58] <msk> me neither, far as I recall
[23:20:03] <brong> (and the template in etherpad had it already)
[23:20:20] <Leslie Daigle> Do we really think there are going to be f2f meetings this year?
[23:20:20] Sean Turner leaves the room
[23:20:28] <Jared Mauch> Yes
[23:20:34] <Mark Baushke (Juniper)> is there a URL for the slides?
[23:20:35] <Jared Mauch> there will be f2f meetings this year
[23:20:39] <Jonathan Lennox> I see November as still within the realm of possibility?
[23:20:40] Ted Lemon leaves the room
[23:20:44] <Andrew Sullivan> I don't think anyone knows whether there will be f2f later in the year
[23:20:45] Ted Lemon joins the room
[23:20:52] <John Scudder> @Leslie if anyone's making book, I've got $20 on "no"
[23:21:00] <Andrew Sullivan> I don't want to state my own betting :)
[23:21:10] <neednnelg@sure.im> I'm not buying air tickets yet.  Even the olympics cancelled
[23:21:10] Ted Lemon leaves the room
[23:21:16] <adam> I've got $150 on "no", and another $25 on "and not in March 2021"
[23:21:24] <Leslie Daigle> @neednnelg — the Olympics delayed, didn't cancel
[23:21:27] <Jonathan Lennox> I wouldn't bet 1:1 on it but there's some odds I'd bet at.
[23:21:44] <neednnelg@sure.im> @Leslie Daigle - technically yes.
[23:21:45] Karl leaves the room
[23:21:46] <mcr> does the IRTF have a Youtube channel, and/or does the IETF Channel have an IRTF playlist?
[23:21:46] <mcr> Jared, yes, but it continued to fail to load for me....
[23:21:48] <lpardue> An old silent chat...
Unmuted microphone,
splash! Silence again.
[23:21:48] <lpardue> An old silent chat...
[23:21:48] <lpardue> an old silent chat...
unmuted microphone,
splash! Silence again.
[23:21:48] <James Gruessing> You’re all being very optimistic.
[23:21:52] <John Scudder> @Leslie semantics
[23:22:00] <csperkins> IRTF talks appear on the IETF channel
[23:22:11] <Larry> yes please +1 fix tools and re-render
[23:22:15] <adam> James Gruessing: Wow. Never expected that response to my stance. :)
[23:22:19] <mcr> yes, I think we can tolerate regenerating the PDF.
[23:22:21] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> Has anyone looked at the "canonical" XML and grimaced at how some of
it has two-space indentation and some of it is unindented at all, even
within the same document?
[23:22:23] <nemo> @brong Thank you!
[23:22:27] <Ross> I wouldn't bet on November, either.  IMHO, Thailand's unlikely to allow a meeting there then, without entry requirements that would likely be unacceptable for us
[23:22:36] <jimsch1> +1 regenertion of docs later better than slowing down
[23:22:40] Leslie Daigle nods
[23:22:41] <John Scudder> @James well there's also the "virtual from here on out, forever" position I guess.
[23:22:42] <mcr> kaduk, yes, because I can't convince co-authors that nice looking XML has value.
[23:22:45] <James Gruessing> adam: sorry, Jabber client truncated the /s
[23:22:49] Karl joins the room
[23:22:52] <mcr> Some use editors that pretty it all up, and some don't.
[23:22:59] ysakemin joins the room
[23:23:25] Eric Vyncke joins the room
[23:23:28] <Larry> changes shouldn't be accepted without documentation?
[23:23:37] <sureshk@jabber.org> @jhaas: agree. The actuals came in later but I had slack in the orders
[23:23:40] <mnot> You'd think, @larry
[23:23:48] <Cindy Morgan> @Mark Baushke: Materials are posted at https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/materials/ (separated by presenter, not in one deck)
[23:23:56] <jhaas> @kaduk right. it'd be nice to do an xmllint to normalize the indentation.
[23:24:05] <sureshk@jabber.org> I also passed back the numbers. The bigger issue is the sizing being non standard.
[23:24:14] <sureshk@jabber.org> L in China is not the same as L in Dallas :-)
[23:24:20] <jhoyla> The word "naïve" would be nice.
[23:24:44] <Larry> I have a simple solution to the confusables and proofreading: ask some 3rd party to transcribe
[23:24:51] <James Gruessing> Perhaps we need policy for romanisation for naming conventions?
[23:25:10] <jhaas> @sureshk indeed, and my feedback was that we standardize on a brand to handle that. :-)
[23:25:15] <lpardue> an RFC for RNC?
[23:25:34] Rob Evans joins the room
[23:25:41] <sureshk@jabber.org> @jhaas: +1
[23:25:44] <Klensin> @James: that is  more or less what we were doing until the IETF decided to allow characters outside Basic Latin (aka ASCCII) in RFCs
[23:25:49] <Larry> if an IDN or author name can't be printed out by one person, sent to another as an image, and then recognized and rewritten, then dont accept it
[23:25:52] marka joins the room
[23:25:52] marka leaves the room
[23:26:26] <msk> WHAT?!
[23:26:41] <mcr> Q: for nomcom chair. 1) were any of your voting members exclusively remote?  2) did you do any interviews of candidates where the candidate or voting members were a mix of local/remote?
[23:26:54] <brong> mcr is that a "MIC"?
[23:27:00] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> mcr: isn't the webex chat for mic queue management?
[23:27:07] <John Scudder> @mcr if you want to ask that for realz, do a +1 over in the webex window I think
[23:27:07] <Mike StJohns> @mcr - I'm pretty sure the anser to both of those questions is No
[23:27:08] <Martin Thomson> I wonder, can we also put people's real names in slides?  I'm almost certain that those ASCII sequences aren't canonical.
[23:27:17] <Jared Mauch> you need to +Q in the chat
[23:27:21] <Mike StJohns> you mean +q
[23:27:22] <mcr> brong: yes, MIC. I'm sure when/if we were doing that are webex mic queue.
[23:27:29] <John Scudder> yes
[23:27:54] <Andrew Sullivan> I apologise for still not having a nomcom chair to announce,
[23:27:54] <mcr> or, if we were doing questions later on.
[23:28:24] marka joins the room
[23:28:35] <John Scudder> @mcr well if you want to say it, no reason not to "stand at the mic" now and that covers both bases.
[23:28:51] <John Scudder> … and so you have
[23:30:14] Steve Feldman joins the room
[23:31:07] <mcr> thank you.
[23:31:12] Suzanne joins the room
[23:31:16] Suzanne leaves the room
[23:31:25] <tale > There's a Mr T meme up, what's wrong with the term MacGyvered?
[23:31:38] Rich Salz joins the room
[23:31:54] <Andrew Sullivan> BTW, small fun fact that I have noticed in thinking about deadly illness and continuity: the nomcom chair is defined so that it must be appointed by the ISOC President.  The ISOC President is always and only the ISOC CEO.  It's not clear whether that extends to a temporary CEO in the event the CEO dies in office.
[23:32:04] Suzanne joins the room
[23:32:15] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> Andrew: I suggest not dying.
[23:32:19] <Jonathan Lennox> tale: A cultural reference that won't be understood by everyone, I guess?
[23:32:21] <Ted.h> @Andrew don't die, please.
[23:32:24] KurtA joins the room
[23:32:33] <Ted.h> thnx.
[23:32:38] <Andrew Sullivan> @kaduk: that's my plan too, yes :)
[23:32:39] <tale > unless., of course, it's useful for tax purposes
[23:32:49] <Suzanne> @tale but only for a year
[23:32:50] <neednnelg@sure.im> @Andrew - oh now our very own constitutional crisis
[23:32:57] francesca leaves the room
[23:33:31] kiran.ietf leaves the room
[23:33:42] <Jonathan Lennox> Presumably ISOC has its own processes for appointing a new CEO?
[23:34:36] <Andrew Sullivan> @Jonathan: it does.  The CEO is appointed by the Board of Trustees.  But it isn't clear whether an interim CEO qualifies for this.  Just a wrinkle that we'll have to sort out a rule for.
[23:35:37] <Klensin> @Andrew: yet another reason for you to take care of yourself and stay careful.   I'm all in favor of making sure contingency plans are in place, but ...
[23:36:11] KurtA-laptop joins the room
[23:36:23] <Larry> yes
[23:36:43] <Andrew Sullivan> I'm in isolation anyway, so I don't expect to catch anything :). It just struck me as a funny vulnerability we have: there's a magic person who has to do something.
[23:36:48] <spencerdawkins> I suppose Doing The Right Thing is out of the question, if the BCP doesn't work for us? :-(
[23:36:49] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> I guess a given speaker shouldn't unmute right when they finish, so as
to be able to give the ACK to the next speaker in the 3-way handshake.
[23:36:49] kiran.ietf joins the room
[23:36:57] <John Levine> @andrew while I hope as much as anyone that you remain safe and sound, the ISOC trustees can appoint a new president by resolution if we have to
[23:37:18] <adam> Andrew: We're IETFers. I presume we've all been in isolation since November.
[23:37:36] <Jared Mauch> some of us are more social (and stir crazy as a result) than others.
[23:37:37] Christian Huitema joins the room
[23:38:14] <James Gruessing> I’m not sure spending time with spouse/kids and nobody else counts as being social, per se
[23:38:17] <jhoyla> I'm happy to be social online :P
[23:39:30] <lpardue> I just go on Zoom and play rinking games
[23:40:44] Kurta joins the room
[23:40:47] behcet leaves the room
[23:41:04] <ek> is the LLC investment policy statement published somewhere?
[23:41:30] <Jay Daley> No it isn't - contains confidential information.
[23:41:33] <Martin J. Dürst> suggestion for slides: Please align numbers on the right, thanks.
[23:41:46] <Samuel Weiler> jay: publish a redacted one?
[23:42:03] <Jay Daley> @Sam: On my list
[23:42:20] <ek> that'd be great, thanks
[23:42:26] <Samuel Weiler> (also, what's confidential there?)
[23:43:15] <Jay Daley> Not sure TBH
[23:43:30] <Andrew Sullivan> You can't always tell people what's confidential in a confidential document
[23:44:09] <Mike StJohns> @Jay - Did the IETF endowment get folded in under the LLC?
[23:44:20] <Jay Daley> @Mike: Yes
[23:44:30] <Mike StJohns> Thanks
[23:45:45] <Klensin> @Jay to save mic time, would you be sure that the meeting materials, and particularly your slides and Jason's, get uploaded to meeting materials -- trying to pull them a few minutes ago didn't work, at least in the "view" and "PDF" formats.
[23:46:02] <James Gruessing> There’s something up with DT I suspect
[23:46:06] <Karen O'Donoghue> Reminder: If you want the jabber scribe (me) to ask a question for you, then type MIC: <your question> here and I will ask for you, otherwise, please put +q in the webex chat and ask for yourself.
[23:46:06] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> I thought it was normal for plenary slides to not be uploaded in
[23:46:07] <Jay Daley> @John: Will do
[23:46:26] ChrisBox joins the room
[23:46:30] <Jay Daley> @John: Or maybe no
[23:46:32] <lpardue> nothing is normal anymore
[23:46:46] mit-hat@jabber.hot-chilli.net leaves the room
[23:46:56] mit-hat@jabber.hot-chilli.net joins the room
[23:47:39] <James Gruessing> MIC: Is there a target date for go/no go for IETF 108?
[23:47:43] <Mike StJohns> @kaduk - they should be  except if they contain "surprise" information...  like the ANRP winner.
[23:47:58] Ted Lemon joins the room
[23:48:19] mit-hat@jabber.hot-chilli.net leaves the room
[23:49:02] Ted Lemon leaves the room
[23:49:33] tim costello joins the room
[23:49:40] <Rich Salz> There's no jabber scribe, James Gruessing — put +q in the webex chat
[23:49:52] <mnot> actually...
[23:50:02] <Larry> is there any contingency planning for the possibility of all virtual meetings from now on
[23:50:04] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> Rich: Karen is jaber scribe
[23:50:10] <stpeter> I think @brong is the scribe
[23:50:14] <Karen O'Donoghue> @ Rich… I'm the jabber scribe for those that don't want to do that
[23:50:20] <stpeter> aha, OK :-)
[23:50:25] <James Gruessing> Thank you Karen.
[23:50:26] <brong> Karen O'Donoghue is the scribe
[23:50:27] <lpardue> there is no spoon
[23:50:28] <Rich Salz> i thought Alissa said use the q+ thing.  oh well.
[23:50:35] <stpeter> Larry: is that a question for the MIC?
[23:50:36] <Jared Mauch> that's to enter the queue
[23:50:45] <Karen O'Donoghue> Reminder: If you want the jabber scribe (me) to ask a question for you, then type MIC: <your question> here and I will ask for you, otherwise, please put +q in the webex chat and ask for yourself.
[23:50:48] <Rich Salz> too many chat's and webex.  oh well. sorry for the mis-info
[23:50:48] <Jonathan Lennox> Use the q+ thing to speak on WebEx, use MIC to have Karen do it for you
[23:51:27] ekr@jabber.org joins the room
[23:51:31] <John Levine> @jck ISOC has had a similar whistleblower hotline for a long time
[23:52:16] Ted Lemon joins the room
[23:52:17] <martin.duke> go/nogo is the day after you buy your nonrefundable plane tickets
[23:52:23] Hans Kuhn leaves the room
[23:52:25] <Jared Mauch> yeah, it's weird to have so many platforms and ways to get access to the info.. i always find the wrong way to get to the meeting materials because things like the overall agenda and wg agendas aren't linked together well.. then you have 3rd party API things like the app
[23:52:34] <Andrew Sullivan> And we require it for legal reasons related to compliance with IRS rules, and so require it of any disregarded entity that is under ISOC too
[23:53:05] <Pete Resnick> LLC better not be doing something about anti-trust. That would be an IESG thing to do.
[23:53:24] Ted Lemon leaves the room
[23:53:57] Karl leaves the room
[23:54:02] <Ted.h> https://www.iab.org/internet-architecture-board-conflict-of-interest-policy/
[23:54:09] <Ted.h> for the IAB policy.
[23:54:22] ChrisBox leaves the room
[23:54:22] <John Levine> @jck reports all seem to be here now https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/107/proceedings
[23:54:23] nemo joins the room
[23:54:31] kiran.ietf leaves the room: I'm not here right now
[23:54:56] <joehall> there’s yr echo, Rich
[23:54:56] nemo leaves the room
[23:55:20] <Rich Salz> :)
[23:55:31] <cabo> Who is Michael Jenkins?
[23:55:33] <stpeter> Michael Jenkins seems to be the echo source.
[23:55:45] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> Michael Jenkins, NSA?
[23:55:54] <stpeter> muted now
[23:57:36] andrew@depht.com leaves the room
[23:57:37] <dino> the Madrid IETF is the same week in July as the Tokyo 2020 Olympics, and you know what they decided
[23:57:45] andrew@depht.com joins the room
[23:58:00] <John Scudder> though they do have slightly different constraints
[23:58:02] <brong> it takes longer to train for the Olympics to be in peak condition
[23:58:07] <Jared Mauch> I would say until you can register for 108, I wouldn't worry about 108
[23:58:13] <brong> I get into peak IETF condition by drinking beer and eating cookies
[23:58:27] <Klensin> @John Levine: Thanks.  Was trying to pull the meeting materials up from the agenda link.  Note to everyone relevant -- especially for mostly-remote meetings, we need to do better at getting this stuff synchronized.
[23:59:05] <Larry> thanks
[23:59:12] merm joins the room
[23:59:14] <lpardue> @brong and you're all outta cookies?
[23:59:18] <John Levine> our web sites have a chronic redundancy probiem, viz. three copies of every RFC
[23:59:35] <kaduk@jabber.openafs.org/barnowl> Pete, who are you?
[23:59:38] <brong> [ACCEPT COOKIES: {Y/N}]