IETF
QUIC
quic@jabber.ietf.org
Friday, July 21, 2017< ^ >
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Room Configuration
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GMT+0
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[07:29:24] <Michael Bishop> It's half past midnight -- no claim to awake here.  Sober, though!
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[07:36:01] <Martin Duke> After some technical hiccups, I am here to talk 2nd draft
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[07:40:08] <Marten Seemann> We can just use some kind of packet pacing if we want to avoid flow control, e.g. have a sleep(1ms) before sending any packet
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[07:44:05] <Michael Bishop> +1 for HTTP/0.9
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[07:44:49] <Brian Trammell> so HTTP/0.9, GET only, multiplexed. Do we need to write it up in more detail than that?
[07:44:58] <Brian Trammell> (or am I free to go? ;) )
[07:45:25] <Lars Eggert> i think martin can just stick that into a bullet on the wiki page
[07:45:30] <Lars Eggert> so you're off the hook
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[07:45:42] <Brian Trammell> yep that's my read of it too but I wanted someone else to make that call. :)
[07:46:11] <Michael Bishop> HTTP/0.9 only has GET by definition.  HTTP/1.0 introduced the idea of extensible methods.
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[07:46:20] <dkg> although i was just kidding at the mic, the more i think about this the more it really does look like FTP :/
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[07:46:57] <Martin Duke> I think we have a solid sketch of what we're doing. I am maybe a little too far behind on my implementation to add the necessary detail beyond the sketch I'm about to finish.
[07:47:38] <Brian Trammell> dkg: so the (tiny) issue I'd have is that we'd need to define how to hack FTP to use stream versus port reference…
[07:47:49] <dkg> Brian Trammell: yeah, it's true
[07:48:03] <Brian Trammell> dkg: i mean, you're not wrong, but this is twelve seconds faster to specify. :)
[07:48:04] <dkg> Brian Trammell: and FTP has inter-stream dependencies, which isn't as simple as HTTP GET-only
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[07:48:32] <Michael Bishop> https://www.w3.org/Protocols/HTTP/AsImplemented.html
[07:49:52] <Brian Trammell> dkg: so if we did end up with composable unidirectional streams, a protocol with arbitrary stream dependency would be a good way to exercise that.
[07:50:16] <Brian Trammell> that's a slightly different protocol than FTP though. I suggest calling it Filetransfer, Useless, over QUIC.
[07:50:35] <dkg> ha ha
[07:51:04] <dkg> Filetransfer, Unidirectional, over QUIC
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[07:51:14] <Brian Trammell> even better
[07:51:34] <dkg> and the handshake can only use the BADA55 or 4Q curves :P
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[07:53:24] <Lars Eggert> slides are now all in the repo and datatracker - sory for being late
[07:53:32] <ekr> thanks
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[08:03:59] <Michael Bishop> The packet type and any fields specific to the packet type are version-specific.
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[08:31:49] <Martin Duke> chatroulette over quic!
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[08:36:53] <Martin Thomson> mnot: Lars Eggert: can we get some sort of question on timing for 2nd implementation?
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[08:37:27] <Lars Eggert> for this or in general?
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[08:43:28] <Lars Eggert> have we discussed the option of "upgrading" a stream from unidir to bidir, e.g., by opening the same stream ID in reverse? it makes the transport more complex, but would give the apps flexibility
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[08:43:56] <Michael Bishop> When I discussed this with our devs, it was the transport dev who wanted bidirectionality at the transport, but the HTTP dev who said "that should be fine."
[08:44:08] <Marten Seemann> @Lars: How would that work with the MAX_STREAM_ID mechanism?
[08:44:28] <Lars Eggert> @marten dunno (half baked)
[08:44:53] <Lars Eggert> but those mechanisms can change, too, if needed
[08:45:17] <Marten Seemann> @Lars: And, wouldn't this just be Ian proposal (the one with the closed bit) in reverse (with an open bit)?
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[08:45:46] <Lars Eggert> i don't think you need a bit if you require identical IDs
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[08:46:43] <Michael Bishop> Modeling bidirectional as paired unidirectional:  This is actually implicit in the DISINTEREST PR.
[08:46:45] <Simone Ferlin> sorry, i was in other "room" any comment on multipath with QUIC aready? :)
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[08:47:06] <Alan Frindell> not yet
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[08:47:13] <craigt> Simone Ferlin:  not got there yet
[08:47:21] <Martin Thomson> Michael Bishop: I agree
[08:47:52] <Simone Ferlin> Thanks!
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[08:55:19] <Marten Seemann> what window?
[08:55:25] <ekr> Overton Window
[08:58:21] <lucaspardue> @lars how many people have read #672
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[08:59:13] <Michael Bishop> You can separate those because the proposals can be refined.
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[08:59:52] <Michael Bishop> Hum for unidirectional.
[09:00:05] <Marten Seemann> Hum for bidirectional
[09:00:07] <Victor Vasiliev> hum for basing on bidi
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[09:22:33] <Michael Bishop> Pretty sure that Windows doesn't expose this currently.
[09:23:29] <Martin Thomson> solution: transport parameter negotiation
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[09:27:41] <Ingemar Johansson> hum
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