IETF
QUIC
quic@jabber.ietf.org
Tuesday, November 14, 2017< ^ >
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[05:32:32] <joel jaeggli> agenda bashing
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[05:33:16] <joel jaeggli> upcoming interim meeting
[05:33:26] <joel jaeggli> jan 2018
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[05:34:06] <joel jaeggli> https://github.com/quicwg/wg-materials/blob/master/interim-18-01/arrangements.md
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[05:34:34] <joel jaeggli> interop - discussed by eKR
[05:34:49] <joel jaeggli> slide interop matrix
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[05:38:10] <joel jaeggli> next presentation - invariants
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[05:41:51] <joel jaeggli> brian trammel
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[05:42:26] <joel jaeggli> ian ?
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[05:42:34] <craigt> Swett
[05:42:37] <ted.h> Ian Swett
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[05:44:53] <joel jaeggli> ? -
[05:45:14] <joel jaeggli> mark akamai
[05:45:26] <craigt> Mike Bishop
[05:45:58] <joel jaeggli> brett jordan
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[05:47:11] <craigt> This is Roni at the mic btw
[05:47:35] <craigt> Roni Even
[05:48:24] <joel jaeggli> brian trammel
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[05:49:37] <joel jaeggli> colin
[05:50:16] <joel jaeggli> john ?
[05:50:50] <Jonathan Lennox> That was me
[05:50:58] <joel jaeggli> ok
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[05:51:38] <joel jaeggli> janna
[05:52:37] <Daniel> the mic seems to sound better on meetecho than in the room, we can here speakers just fine
[05:52:46] <Daniel> hear
[05:52:56] <Jonathan Lennox> The room is very echo-y.
[05:52:58] <Lars Eggert> maybe we need to turn the in-room volume up
[05:52:59] <joel jaeggli> ekr
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[05:55:03] <ted.h> So I don't have to get up to the mic with my pedantry:  the set of invariants on slide 3 does not include "Use UDP as the demux layer", and it should.  
[05:55:20] <joel jaeggli> martin presenting again
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[05:55:38] <kadukoafs@gmail.com/barnowl21C1A14B> ted.h: we can call it pedanticism instead if that helps.
[05:55:55] <joel jaeggli> ben schwartz
[05:56:23] <joel jaeggli> brian trammel
[05:57:00] <joel jaeggli> ian
[05:57:31] <joel jaeggli> ekr
[05:57:33] <ted.h> invariant =\= ossified already
[05:58:01] <joel jaeggli> brian trammel
[05:58:20] <joel jaeggli> janna ayer
[05:58:49] <Daniel> "Jana Iyengar"
[05:59:15] <joel jaeggli> roni even
[05:59:16] <Daniel> (got the spelling from his mailing list postings)
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[06:00:43] <joel jaeggli> colin
[06:01:04] <craigt> Colin Perkins
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[06:02:45] <joel jaeggli> /help
[06:02:57] <joel jaeggli> never mind
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[06:04:15] <joel jaeggli> bernard aboba speaking
[06:05:16] <joel jaeggli> colin perkins
[06:05:45] <joel jaeggli> roni even
[06:06:31] <ted.h> What was ekr's suggestion for this?
[06:06:46] <joel jaeggli> spencer dawkins
[06:06:55] <ted.h> Over what time scale?
[06:07:58] <Bernard Aboba> Mike: There is an additional problem with Option 2, which is that it allocates *all* of the unallocated code points to QUIC.  So header issues not withstanding, that is not great.
[06:08:23] <joel jaeggli> bernard aboba
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[06:11:23] <Victor Vasiliev> TURN channels only happen after you negotiate session via STUN
[06:11:54] <Victor Vasiliev> They don't occur during the handshake, they are negotiated via full STUN packets
[06:12:09] <Lars Eggert> victor: for the mic?
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[06:12:42] <Victor Vasiliev> Yes
[06:13:59] <joel jaeggli> mark nottingham
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[06:15:28] <joel jaeggli> janna
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[06:19:50] <joel jaeggli> colin perkins
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[06:21:15] <joel jaeggli> magnus
[06:21:36] <Daniel> Magnus Westerlund
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[06:22:40] <joel jaeggli> martin duke
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[06:25:11] <joel jaeggli> roni even
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[06:29:23] <joel jaeggli> spancer dawkins
[06:30:01] <joel jaeggli> ekr
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[06:33:41] <joel jaeggli> colin perkins
[06:34:41] <Victor Vasiliev> I am seriously confused by Colin's point.  As long as you can negotiate ALPN, you can send whatever you want over QUIC
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[06:35:47] <joel jaeggli> ted hardie
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[06:39:47] <joel jaeggli> ronnie even
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[06:41:15] <joel jaeggli> ian
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[06:42:11] <ted.h> Don't see him.
[06:42:16] <ted.h> Spencer is here.
[06:42:37] <ted.h> (Sorry, wrong window)
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[06:42:55] <Lucas Pardue> for the mic: when is a revised milestone plan likely to come out?
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[06:43:22] <Lucas Pardue> ok sgtm
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[06:47:09] <joel jaeggli> ? -
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[06:47:59] <Spencer Dawkins> @ted, sorry, I'm in the jabber room now.
[06:48:13] <Lars Eggert> praveen
[06:48:27] <joel jaeggli> brian trammel
[06:48:44] <Lars Eggert> praveen balasubramian
[06:48:54] <Lars Eggert> (sp?)
[06:49:13] <Daniel> Praveen Balasubramanian
[06:49:23] <Lars Eggert> thanks
[06:49:27] <Lars Eggert> (and sorry)
[06:49:34] <joel jaeggli> ekr
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[06:53:08] <joel jaeggli> mike bishop
[06:54:57] <joel jaeggli> next presentation
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[06:55:15] <joel jaeggli> ted hardia - spin bit rtt evaluation
[06:55:20] <joel jaeggli> hardie
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[06:57:14] <Martin Thomson> little q initiator, big Q responder
[06:58:13] <Martin Thomson> also, the ack delay
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[07:00:37] <Jonathan Lennox> Does spin bit need to be an invariant?
[07:01:00] <Martin Thomson> well, if we decided to add it, then we could also decide to make it invariant
[07:02:49] <Spencer Dawkins> I don't want to take meeting time to ask this later, but is HTTP/2 likely to generate sparse traffic for a significant percentage of the time? I've spent more time looking at HTTP/1.0 and HTTP/1.1.1 traces, so honest question.
[07:04:10] <Jonathan Lennox> If this is something intended for middleboxes to observe it seems like it's going to need to be an invariant.
[07:04:13] <Daniel> Spencer Dawkins, h2 is more likely to reuse the same connection for traffic, but otherwise I would think it generally uses the same pattern has h1
[07:04:17] <joel jaeggli> brian trammel
[07:04:18] <Martin Thomson> h2 isn't materially different, unless you have websockets, or push-dominant
[07:05:22] <Spencer Dawkins> thank you folks for heling me be a better AD. :D
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[07:06:30] <Lucas Pardue> HTTP-based streaming has slightly different session characteristics compared to traditional webpage loading
[07:06:47] <joel jaeggli> miria khuelwind
[07:07:08] <Daniel> Mirja K├╝hlewind
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[07:08:05] <joel jaeggli> ronnie even
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[07:09:02] <joel jaeggli> ian
[07:09:07] <Jonathan Lennox> Joel: "roni"
[07:09:43] <joel jaeggli> daniel
[07:11:19] <joel jaeggli> martin
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[07:12:29] <Martin Thomson> that was marten seeman
[07:12:53] <Daniel> Gorry Fairhurst
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[07:13:46] <joel jaeggli> thomas nokia
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[07:16:32] <joel jaeggli> al morton
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[07:19:52] <Samuel Jero_> +1 to Jana's comment
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[07:23:11] <joel jaeggli> dan
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[07:24:37] <gryning> I still don't buy that this can't be done in path at a different layer: I understand the overhead, but if it's not possible then segment routing is undeployable? ...seems if the motivation is correct middle boxes are happy to add useful data...
[07:25:04] <joel jaeggli> colin
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[07:25:59] <craigt> sorry gryning==craigt; net issues seem to rename me
[07:26:14] <joel jaeggli> gorry
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[09:03:52] soareschen leaves the room: Stream reset by peer
[09:03:56] soareschen joins the room
[09:04:35] ted.h joins the room
[09:04:55] ted.h leaves the room
[09:21:16] lizan joins the room
[09:27:50] blassey leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:30:15] Jonathan Lennox leaves the room
[09:30:51] joel jaeggli leaves the room
[09:31:20] joel jaeggli joins the room
[09:32:09] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[09:33:26] lizan joins the room
[09:34:59] soareschen leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[09:39:06] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[09:39:09] altx leaves the room
[09:40:06] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room
[09:40:41] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:40:43] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room
[09:41:12] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:41:16] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:42:01] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:42:03] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:42:21] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:42:24] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:45:30] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:45:36] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:45:56] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:45:58] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:48:23] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:48:29] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room
[09:50:59] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:54:24] joel jaeggli leaves the room
[09:54:27] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:55:06] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:55:08] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:55:36] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[09:55:46] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[09:57:39] lizan joins the room
[09:57:56] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[10:02:13] lizan joins the room
[10:07:53] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[10:12:58] lizan joins the room
[10:18:37] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[10:22:13] hta leaves the room
[10:27:03] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[10:27:08] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room
[11:31:15] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[11:31:19] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[12:43:13] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[12:43:14] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[12:52:31] lizan joins the room
[12:58:11] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[13:10:37] sjero joins the room
[13:12:19] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:12:20] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:12:29] sjero leaves the room
[13:12:44] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:13:36] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:13:41] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:13:48] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:13:52] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:14:17] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:14:22] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:14:29] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:16:17] joel jaeggli joins the room
[13:19:46] joel jaeggli leaves the room
[13:28:34] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:28:34] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:29:00] lizan joins the room
[13:29:11] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:29:29] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:29:48] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:29:50] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:34:44] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[13:48:18] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:48:21] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:48:29] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:48:53] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:51:39] Ranjeeth Dasineni joins the room
[13:51:43] Ranjeeth Dasineni leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[13:54:00] lizan joins the room
[13:59:40] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[14:12:21] lizan joins the room
[14:17:55] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[14:19:00] joel jaeggli joins the room
[14:39:15] hta joins the room
[14:39:43] hta leaves the room
[14:40:27] hta joins the room
[14:47:41] lizan joins the room
[15:03:04] hta leaves the room
[16:21:43] m&m joins the room
[16:24:42] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[16:36:17] lizan joins the room
[16:41:57] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[16:44:03] m&m leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[16:52:55] lizan joins the room
[16:58:34] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[17:21:41] m&m joins the room
[17:38:12] m&m leaves the room: Disconnected: closed
[18:56:16] m&m joins the room
[19:14:00] m&m leaves the room: Disconnected: No route to host
[22:02:28] lizan joins the room
[23:14:21] joel jaeggli leaves the room
[23:15:20] hta joins the room
[23:42:29] joel jaeggli joins the room
[23:43:09] lizan leaves the room: Connection failed: ping_timeout
[23:44:14] joel jaeggli leaves the room
[23:44:57] joel jaeggli joins the room
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