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[10:59:55] <Chris Lemmons> I heard that "test", audio, so something is working. :)
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[11:00:48] <Maksim Proshin> Yes
[11:00:50] <Neal Cardwell> Yes, we can hear the audio
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[11:00:58] <Chris Lemmons> Yup, working well.
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[11:01:24] <Martin Duke> Hmm, I can't hear it. Ill check my setup
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[11:02:41] <Martin Duke> There, that worked
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[11:04:36] <Neal Cardwell> I'll take notes.
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[11:05:29] <Martin Duke> There's someone in the queue
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[11:20:53] <Mirja Kühlewind> sorry, have problem with my audio... switch to a different machine now. Now sure if you got all of what I said. I missed most of Michaels reply now unfortunately...
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[11:22:30] <Richard Scheffenegger> yes
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[11:25:33] <Mirja Kühlewind> +1 to the updates to the registry
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[11:27:06] <Martin Duke> So how will IANA react when we overwrite bits 7-9 with the AccECN bits?
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[11:28:55] <Martin Duke> Yes I want to raise that point
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[11:31:19] <Martin Duke> @Mirja sounds good to me
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[11:32:18] <Martin Duke> I'm comfortable with these responses.
[11:32:19] <Martin Duke> thanks
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[11:34:20] <Richard Scheffenegger> muted
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[11:48:58] <Gorry Fairhurst> I like the direction of these proposed changes …
[11:51:42] <Richard Scheffenegger> yup
[11:51:46] <Chris Lemmons> Yes, we can hear.
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[11:59:52] <Bob Briscoe> What's the protocol for joining the mic queue? (I joined late due to audio problems)
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[12:01:36] <Mirja Kühlewind> There is a button on top: the mic with the hand circle
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[12:01:48] <Bob Briscoe> Thx
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[12:02:21] <Tobia Castaldi> Hi Bob, in case you have comments or questions you can join the mic queue! Is up tu chairs to accep/deny requests.
[12:03:29] <Martin Duke> argh RFC 3782 is Experimental, too
[12:03:39] <Martin Duke> 3742
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[12:10:16] <lpardue> We (cloudflare) deployed it for all QUIC connections in May, in combination with CUBIC
[12:10:55] <Richard Scheffenegger> bob you are illegible
[12:10:57] <Praveen Balasubramanian> sorry cannot hear
[12:11:21] <Bob Briscoe> I'm afraid meet echo isn't working for me. Here's my question over chat...
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[12:13:16] <Bob Briscoe> Extending Stuart's question, am I corect the the threshold /is/ relative to the previous round's minRTT (it's 1/8), but the upper and lower threshold's are constants, not relative to thresholds
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[12:20:21] <Bob Briscoe> Sry, I meant "not relative to RTT"
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[12:31:48] <Michael Scharf> The last MPTCP talk from the first slot will move to the second slot _before_ the "if time permits" part
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[12:35:24] <Richard Scheffenegger> will this room stay open during the break? (12.40-13.00)?
[12:35:38] <Jiao Kang> Hi, it is the first time i use this tool. In fact, I cannot see the update on slide pages. Does other meet the same problem?
[12:36:06] <Michael Scharf> I don't know if the meeting stays oepn, sorry
[12:36:19] <Richard Scheffenegger> you may have paused the slide stream. if you hover over, there are buttons top-left of the sub-window
[12:37:22] <Jiao Kang> thanks
[12:40:21] <Mirja Kühlewind> i will stay open for 5 minutes after the session I think
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[12:45:04] <Mirja> I guess it was less than 5 minutes then...
[12:45:32] <Meetecho> Mirja: actually we never close rooms automatically, we wait for an active "close the room" command. Did the chair close the meeting by mistake?
[12:45:53] <Meetecho> We're monitoring sessions, sothat when chairs don't close rooms, we do, but we didn't close this ourselves
[12:46:18] <Mirja> no idea. but we have another session next. So no real problem
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[12:57:23] <Neal Cardwell> Hi. I will be unable to take notes for this second session. Apologies.
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[12:57:37] <Neal Cardwell> Hopefully someone else is available to take notes for the second session.
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[13:00:35] <Mirja Kühlewind> @meetecho there are mails on the wgchairs list that for many session the meeting ended abruptly... fyi
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[13:01:06] <Meetecho> Mirja Kühlewind: I think it happened in TCPM and SPRING, we'll be looking into this as soon as sessions end today
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[13:01:30] <Wesley Eddy> I can help
[13:01:51] <Mirja Kühlewind> @meetecho thanks
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[13:23:23] <Martin Duke> @Kazuho you have to share audio too, to speak
[13:23:30] <Kazuho Oku> Sorry I clicked the wrong butten
[13:23:51] <Mirja Kühlewind> if you click again to should disappear
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[13:24:10] <Lars Eggert> how do i hum?
[13:24:37] <Jana Iyengar> THe little tab that looks like a bar graph
[13:25:04] <Lars Eggert> so what is the question for the hum? where do i see this?
[13:25:12] <Jana Iyengar> hum's over
[13:25:16] <Martin Duke> the question is not listed anywhere.
[13:25:19] <Martin Duke> you have to listen
[13:25:25] <Lars Eggert> ok, so this functionality is crap
[13:25:31] <Mahesh Jethanandani> The tool does not provide for posting a question.
[13:25:36] <Martin Duke> that was a test question
[13:25:47] <Lars Eggert> it will still be crap if it is not a test
[13:26:58] <Tobia Castaldi> this is correct!
[13:27:01] <Mahesh Jethanandani> Jan is correct.
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[13:27:58] <Lars Eggert> are you going to do two hums? like a hum against?
[13:28:16] <Lars Eggert> thanks
[13:28:17] <Martin Duke> This hum is in favor of adoption
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[13:28:50] <Yoshifumi Nishida> yes
[13:28:53] <Michael Scharf> I am not allowed to hum buit as author I support WG adoption (obviously)
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[13:29:54] <Richard Scheffenegger> is the hum result just the average of the hums cast, or can you see the participation level in the hum too?
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[13:30:14] <Michael Scharf> We just see the level
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[13:30:46] <Lars Eggert> so this functionality is complete garbage. you have MUCH more information from an in-room hum
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[13:30:51] <Lars Eggert> as chair
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[13:30:56] <Richard Scheffenegger> true
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[13:31:36] <Martin Duke> Can any of the hums against articulate their objection?
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[13:32:50] <Martin Duke> @Lars i would love specific suggestions on improving the hum tool while sticking to the basic properties of the in-room hum
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[13:33:03] <Jana Iyengar> Lars -- this might be useful when there's interest in the room and strong opinions
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[13:33:18] <Jana Iyengar> I suspect this tool doesn't do much when opinions are not strong
[13:33:43] <Jana Iyengar> @Martin Duke: Two specific suggestions:
[13:33:54] <Jana Iyengar> 1. Show the number of people who hummed
[13:33:54] <Jana Iyengar> 2
[13:34:02] <Lars Eggert> well, it's very unclear how this tool averages its input into the output it shows, so your guess is as good as mine...
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[13:34:22] <Jana Iyengar> 2. Use numbers from 1-5 instead of arcane terms :-)
[13:34:39] <Martin Duke> thanks @jana
[13:34:46] <Lars Eggert> you get an average without a stddev or any other information that would you tell something about the inout distribution
[13:35:04] <Richard Scheffenegger> @Martin Duke: typcially we have a set of hums - so "grouping" of hums, and presenting the relative level against each other would be useful
[13:35:13] <Martin Duke> @lars there was an email to ietf@, manycouches@, and an internet-draft with the spec
[13:35:16] <Richard Scheffenegger> also when people hum multiple times...
[13:35:18] <Jana Iyengar> @Lars, I believe it's implementing this: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-duke-shmoo-virtual-hum-00
[13:35:32] <Martin Duke> yes this is mostly my fault
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[13:35:38] <Jana Iyengar> (Martin, is that correct?)
[13:35:48] <Lars Eggert> well, we shouldn't deploy some random dude's -00 stuff :-)
[13:36:21] <Martin Duke> the point of shmoo is to develop consensus for requirements. here we just tried to reproduce the in-room hum.
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[13:36:39] <Lars Eggert> in my defense, this was posted while i was on vacation, so i never saw it
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[13:37:05] <Martin Duke> IMO, I would interpret the hum result as weak support and even weaker opposition to adoption
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[13:37:20] <Jana Iyengar> +1 to Martin's interpretation
[13:37:25] <Martin Duke> as always consensus is on the list
[13:38:17] <Richard Scheffenegger> btw random meetecho Q - can I revert the sorting order of the chat, so that new comments are instantly visible without scrolling?
[13:38:31] <Kent Watsen> disagree. it's med-high support because 1) the tool tallies also the attached Jabber and MeetEcho uses (neither of which can hum) and also does not allow that chairs to hum (though they do support).
[13:38:33] <Jana Iyengar> Honestly, I would prefer something simpler, that just showed the distribution of votes.
[13:39:18] <Jana Iyengar> (I might now be banned from the IETF for using that word)
[13:39:25] <Meetecho> Richard Scheffenegger: that's already what should be happening, if you're looking at the chat and at the last message, it should autoscroll to the new message(s)
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[13:39:39] <Meetecho> If you're not on the chat tab, we stop scrolling to allow you to see what you missed
[13:40:36] <Kent Watsen> So, 45 participants * Pianissimo =~ 20 positive hums.  Now, 20 positive hums + the two missing chairs hums / 39 (the more accurate participant count) --&gt; medium-high support.
[13:41:33] <Jana Iyengar> @Kent: That assumes everyone hummed
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[13:42:17] <Daniel Havey> The audio is terrible.
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[13:43:08] <Richard Scheffenegger> @Meetecho - I would prefer a reverse-time ordering, with the newest comments showing up at the top.
[13:43:25] <Richard Scheffenegger> And no, it doesn't autoscroll and stays at the most recent msg
[13:43:32] <Meetecho> Richard Scheffenegger: ack, we'll take note of this feedback for next time
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[13:44:31] <Martin Duke> @kent that's a reasonable interpretation, although I'd caution your value of 20 has huge error bars
[13:44:32] <Meetecho> Weird, autoscroll works here for me, if the chat tab is selected and new messages arrive
[13:45:27] <Meetecho> It will not autoscroll if messages arrive and e.g., you're on the participants view tab
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[13:45:54] <Martin Duke> Maybe a better way to say it is "the hum was definitely louder to adopt, but it's not overwhelming"
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[13:50:49] <Richard Scheffenegger> @Meetecho - apparently it scrolls sometimes for me too.. but too inconsistent to rely upon
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[13:51:07] <Meetecho> Richard Scheffenegger: we'll look into this, apologies for the annoyance!
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[13:52:06] <Martin Duke> See you in all in Bangkok, hopefully!
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[13:52:15] <Mirja Kühlewind> maybe...
[13:52:18] <Richard Scheffenegger> +BKK ;)
[13:52:21] <Jana Iyengar> Or on Bangkok time, anyway :-)
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[13:52:28] <Mirja Kühlewind> bye
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[13:52:34] <Yoshifumi Nishida> thanks everyone!
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