Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman?
Peter Gutmann <pgut001@cs.auckland.ac.nz> Mon, 31 October 2016 10:07 UTC
Return-Path: <pgut001@cs.auckland.ac.nz>
X-Original-To: cfrg@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: cfrg@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01D9012964F for <cfrg@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 31 Oct 2016 03:07:37 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -5.697
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.697 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-1.497] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=auckland.ac.nz
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Agca4MQAp3Q1 for <cfrg@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 31 Oct 2016 03:07:36 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx4.auckland.ac.nz (mx4.auckland.ac.nz [130.216.125.248]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A074412964B for <cfrg@irtf.org>; Mon, 31 Oct 2016 03:07:35 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=auckland.ac.nz; i=@auckland.ac.nz; q=dns/txt; s=mail; t=1477908455; x=1509444455; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:references:in-reply-to: content-transfer-encoding:mime-version; bh=NMEOw64ni/X6YT3e+LVw5Z0ZKFhEOMj1448LRx+Nlc4=; b=O0aV7GTbXdhhAAnEKjhm3mFi3zMcidzOEhRMYXJ0f3pEASGsL+/Ugjf6 R0I+h3PmL3EY2/RvRL2FmqQQlUyz30YBoppPLACtWBI4nwLuDaGgCkiL5 1Bc3WvJP7q7Jdj95eeaf+XLqCev5boul+KzBt8yIQi2/BAFCVd0LFiYQ1 kIgIQaEq+WpbGF4wNDvcV3KS43E9R6YsyL7JAllIZOtyMEPoGo7yFpL/D cf2+KfdL/Pk2GTeIKkq4qA33WU/kXCRwmDaQlt0Z3ksUBjoAblJQPRXkN wRiZBFUzIBs8RMSkt5YFY+TgLiuIMOfvB1lTiXK5rRmc3ItjszX1t6n7L g==;
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.31,426,1473076800"; d="scan'208";a="112833385"
X-Ironport-HAT: MAIL-SERVERS - $RELAYED
X-Ironport-Source: 10.6.3.5 - Outgoing - Outgoing
Received: from exchangemx.uoa.auckland.ac.nz (HELO uxcn13-tdc-d.UoA.auckland.ac.nz) ([10.6.3.5]) by mx4-int.auckland.ac.nz with ESMTP/TLS/AES256-SHA; 31 Oct 2016 23:07:34 +1300
Received: from uxcn13-ogg-d.UoA.auckland.ac.nz (10.6.2.5) by uxcn13-tdc-d.UoA.auckland.ac.nz (10.6.3.25) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1178.4; Mon, 31 Oct 2016 23:07:34 +1300
Received: from uxcn13-ogg-d.UoA.auckland.ac.nz ([10.6.2.25]) by uxcn13-ogg-d.UoA.auckland.ac.nz ([10.6.2.25]) with mapi id 15.00.1178.000; Mon, 31 Oct 2016 23:07:33 +1300
From: Peter Gutmann <pgut001@cs.auckland.ac.nz>
To: jonas weber <jonasweber86@yandex.com>, "cfrg@irtf.org" <cfrg@irtf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman?
Thread-Index: AQHSMxxtY9gGeJmmR0OrS3v+ehmNA6DCVrbO
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 10:07:32 +0000
Message-ID: <1477908451687.11388@cs.auckland.ac.nz>
References: <2021131477880034@web36j.yandex.ru>
In-Reply-To: <2021131477880034@web36j.yandex.ru>
Accept-Language: en-NZ, en-GB, en-US
Content-Language: en-NZ
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted
x-originating-ip: [130.216.158.4]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/cfrg/Okr0Qrx0nsjDLhxgfs8tMI4Raz8>
Subject: Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman?
X-BeenThere: cfrg@irtf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17
Precedence: list
List-Id: Crypto Forum Research Group <cfrg.irtf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/options/cfrg>, <mailto:cfrg-request@irtf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/cfrg/>
List-Post: <mailto:cfrg@irtf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:cfrg-request@irtf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/cfrg>, <mailto:cfrg-request@irtf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 10:07:37 -0000
jonas weber <jonasweber86@yandex.com> writes: >Given the uncertainty over the RFC-5114 groups, I believe it would be helpful >to have an RFC with a list of primes as you describe. Many of us use shorter >exponents to save computation and having a list of verifiable primes would be >useful, particularly if they could be registered for use in IKE and TLS. I've been having a discussion about this off-list, may as well make it public if others are interested... the main issue is how to generate the values, presumably you'd want safe primes (so p = 2q + 1), g = 2 for efficiency, and some NUMS source for the primes. One suggestion was PBKDF2( "DH 2048" ), PBKDF2( "DH 1024" ), etc as the seed value and then some deterministic way to get from there to the final prime. And maybe pseudocode so anyone can replicate it using whatever bignum library they prefer (rather than, say, "plug the following formula into Mathematica"). How NUMS does it have to get? Peter.
- [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Peter Gutmann
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Martin Thomson
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Peter Gutmann
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? jonas weber
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Peter Gutmann
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Michael StJohns
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Yoav Nir
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: [Cfrg] What groups to use for Diffie Hellman? Peter Gutmann