Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organizations
Enno Rey <erey@ernw.de> Thu, 16 October 2014 17:16 UTC
Return-Path: <erey@ernw.de>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 757E11A1A30; Thu, 16 Oct 2014 10:16:02 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.201
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-0.5, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pd6bqnb46fQ9; Thu, 16 Oct 2014 10:16:00 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx1.ernw.net (mx1.ernw.net [62.159.96.78]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 85ECB1A0262; Thu, 16 Oct 2014 10:16:00 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mh1.ernw.net (unknown [IPv6:fd00:2001:0:d001::10]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "mh1.ernw.net", Issuer "ernw ca1" (verified OK)) by mx1.ernw.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1610B15EC29; Thu, 16 Oct 2014 19:15:58 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from ws25.ernw.net (ws25.ernw.net [172.31.100.10]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-CAMELLIA256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "ws25.ernw.net", Issuer "ernw ca1" (verified OK)) by mh1.ernw.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CBD6C48C; Thu, 16 Oct 2014 19:15:57 +0200 (CEST)
Received: by ws25.ernw.net (Postfix, from userid 1001) id 20644C4876; Thu, 16 Oct 2014 18:53:06 +0200 (CEST)
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2014 18:53:06 +0200
From: Enno Rey <erey@ernw.de>
To: v6ops@ietf.org, grow@ietf.org
Message-ID: <20141016165306.GA44951@ernw.de>
References: <F5C06CAF-0AD2-4225-8EE7-FC72CE9913F0@muada.com> <CAL9jLaZLWG5cKPPhTtLtvn9OQOYwYjdgHCUXsWi3pZJjK+nAbQ@mail.gmail.com> <903173CE-64D6-4FE5-98DB-B408C9586A02@muada.com> <CAL9jLaZiUfb2Pz--nWMq_=DhSz0m4uwDcyPs19PVuq=t6vpyxA@mail.gmail.com> <20141016162257.GH44748@ernw.de> <543FF8C0.9040900@massar.ch>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <543FF8C0.9040900@massar.ch>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15)
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/JsYyYjKRZcFCLeiAM0eSo2gtq5E
Subject: Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organizations
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/v6ops/>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2014 17:16:02 -0000
Hi, On Thu, Oct 16, 2014 at 06:56:32PM +0200, Jeroen Massar wrote: > > to put it equally bluntly, those folks wonder: "hey, we pay a hell lot of money to our uplink providers and they fail to deliver what we contracted, that is transporting our traffic". > > see the examples in https://www.ernw.de/download/RIPE69_Rey_Langner_Slash48_Considered_Harmful_v082_DRAFT.pdf. > > There is a reason why there are PA and PI blocks... or you know, pay for > transiting the aggregate... well ... yes. not sure to what extent $RIRs act accordingly (have been involved in requesting resources from all five of them in the past and can tell you 1st hand that there's quite some encouraging $LARGE_ENTERPRISES to bec ome LIRs, in one way or the other). there must be a reason, why - as far as I can tell - _pretty much all_ large German companies have joined the elitist LIR club in the last two years, preparing their IPv6 depl oyment. RIRs are happily playing that game which is exactly why debate & consensus are needed (and probably Iljitsch brought this to BCOP). that said, $FOLK would pay for it. $YOUR_EMPLOYER has a product with "we guarantee routing your IPv6 more specifics up to /48 for a monthly $FEE" property? Let me know, I'm sure many $FOLKs would be interested in that. leaving them "in the dark" and dependent on the goodwill of (my personal perspective, based on statistics from RIPE RIS: outdated) strict filtering doesn't help anybody. best Enno -- Enno Rey ERNW GmbH - Carl-Bosch-Str. 4 - 69115 Heidelberg - www.ernw.de Tel. +49 6221 480390 - Fax 6221 419008 - Cell +49 173 6745902 Handelsregister Mannheim: HRB 337135 Geschaeftsfuehrer: Enno Rey ======================================================= Blog: www.insinuator.net || Conference: www.troopers.de Twitter: @Enno_Insinuator =======================================================
- [v6ops] Deaggregation by large organizations Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] Deaggregation by large organizations Ted Lemon
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [v6ops] Deaggregation by large organizations Owen DeLong
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Alvaro Retana (aretana)
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Gert Doering
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Gert Doering
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… joel jaeggli
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Jeroen Massar
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Enno Rey
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Jeroen Massar
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Enno Rey
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Owen DeLong
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Owen DeLong
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Gert Doering
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Jeroen Massar
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Christopher Morrow
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Russ White
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Alvaro Retana (aretana)
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Enno Rey
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Jeroen Massar
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data (was: Deagg… Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Mark Andrews
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Matthew Petach
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Owen DeLong
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Mark Andrews
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Matthew Petach
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data (was: Deagg… Marc Binderberger
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data (was: Deagg… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data (was: Deagg… Randy Bush
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Gert Doering
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data Randy Bush
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data (was: Deagg… Robert Raszuk
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data Christopher Morrow
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data Randy Bush
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data Nick Hilliard
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data (was: Deagg… Marc Binderberger
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation data (was: Deagg… Pedro Andres Aranda Gutierrez
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Gert Doering
- [v6ops] renumbering [was Deaggregation by large o… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Ray Hunter
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Ray Hunter
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Matthew Petach
- Re: [v6ops] [GROW] Deaggregation by large organiz… Iljitsch van Beijnum