IETF TICTOC Working Group Meeting
Tuesday, March 23, 2010, 1520-1720

The TICTOC WG meeting was called to order by TICTOC WG co-
chair Yaakov Stein. He was assisted by the NTP WG co-chair 
Karen O'Donoghue in the absence of the TICTOC WG co-chair 
Stewart Bryant. Dave Marlow took the minutes. There was no 
volunteer to act as jabber scribe. The blue sheets were 
distributed, and the agenda was bashed with no changes. 

Agenda
======
1. Agenda bashing (chairs) 5 min  
2. NTP status update (Karen) 10 min  
3. TICTOC status update (chairs) 15 min  
4. Discussion of TICTOC options and future of WG (All) 1 hr  
5. Problem statements (Greg) - if time allows 

NTP WG Status Update
====================
http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/10mar/slides/tictoc-
1/tictoc-1_files/v3_document.htm 

Karen O'Donoghue provided an update on the NTP WG 
deliverables. All four of the NTP document were approved 
for publication, completing the charter for the NTP working 
group.

    draft-ietf-ntp-ntpv4-proto-13.txt
    draft-ietf-ntp-ntpv4-mib-07.txt
    draft-ietf-ntp-dhcpv6-ntp-opt-06.txt
    draft-ietf-ntp-autokey-08.txt

There is a new individual submission on NTP IPv6 router 
advertisement. 

    draft-chen-ntps-ra-opt-00, 

Potential future NTP work includes:
   Router Advertisement option
   NTP equivalent of IEEE 1588 follow-up message 
   Performance options for closed networks

Further discussion of the future of the NTP WG will be 
discussed in the context of the TICTOC WG. 



Status and Future of TICTOC Working Group
=========================================
http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/10mar/slides/tictoc-
0/tictoc-0_files/v3_document.htm

Yaakov Stein presented a brief detailing problems with the 
Working Group's efforts.

They include:
- No meeting at the previous IETF.
- Only the Requirements draft has Working Group status but 
it has now expired
- Definitions and Architecture drafts have not progressed 
to Working Group status
- Gap Analysis, Solutions and MIBs drafts have not been 
started
- Over 1 year late on charter milestones
- Traffic on list has ceased

The Chair initiated a long discussion to try and identify 
what time related subjects should be pursued by the IETF. 
Some of the original Working Group aims are no longer 
meaningful. The 1588 profile and mobile backhauling aspects 
have been pre-empted by other standards organizations 
(ITU).  

There have been a few TICTOC conference calls to refocus 
and get momentum for the working group. These calls 
produced a list of IETF time topics of immediate interest. 
This list was presented to the working group. This resulted 
in discussion on where to go from here. Several opinions 
were expressed. Several additional topics were identified. 
In the end, there was a show of hands where the Chair 
identified level of interest and willingness to contribute:

considerable (++)
some (+) 
little (-) 
none (0)

The results from the rough survey were:  

MPLS Timing Mechanisms: interest= ++ ; willing to work= +
Path Finding: interest= +  ; willing to work= -
NTP Extension: interest= ++ ; willing to work= +
Security of Timing: interest= ++ ; willing to work= +

Ralph Droms, the Working Group's AD, said that the TICTOC 
and NTP working group chairs will look at the results of 
the survey and work to identify the way ahead for time work 
in the IETF.

Management and Security Problem Statements
==========================================
Papers: 
http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/10mar/slides/tictoc-
2/tictoc-2.htm
http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/10mar/slides/tictoc-
3/tictoc-3.htm

Greg Dowd gave a short overview of two problem statements 
prepared for working group consideration. These papers show 
why reasonable people will use different techniques to 
solve their different problems.

The meeting was adjourned around 17:00.